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|| SportsShooter.com: Member Message Board
Bird on Wire
Grace Chiu, Photographer
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Ottawa | ON | Canada | Posted: 7:37 PM on 10.23.10 |
->> I've been shooting for the past 25 days at the Commonwealth Games and the World Gymnastics Championships. I brought along a household companion, named Tandoori Chicken, as a personal mascot which helped fill the "in-between" moments of waiting and waiting. It's a fairly photogenic chicken which garnered a lot of interest in India as well as on my Facebook page. So, once at World Championships in Holland where the word "kip" in Dutch means chicken, but in Gymnastics is a basic bars skill, I decide to bring it out for side shots with the gymnasts, many of whom are also my Facebook friends. The chicken becomes notorious & popular. Other photographers & bloggers bring out their teddy bears and dog chew toys, etc.
Today, Day 8 of competition in Rotterdam, I discover that my Chicken appears in an AP shot yesterday of the men's all around champion, Kohei Uchimura. At first, I'm cheering that my chicken appears in this shot, but then I'm thinking WTF... why has this AP photographer included my chicken without any explanation in the caption? Or why has he not cropped it out? Is this just bad editing or has AP embraced the concept of mascot photojournalism ( if this is what it is...)?
(e.g. http://www.cbc.ca/sports/amateur/story/2010/10/22/sp-uchimura-worlds.html )
I wonder where else in the world this is happening. |
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Israel Shirk, Photographer, Assistant
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Boise | ID | US | Posted: 12:11 AM on 10.24.10 |
| ->> It's probably because the chicken was there and they were on a deadline (and maybe using prefilled captions too), just a guess. Or someone else may have changed the caption. |
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Matthew Sauk, Photographer
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Sandy | UT | United States | Posted: 11:16 AM on 10.24.10 |
| ->> I am confused... |
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Mark Peters, Photographer
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Highland | IL | USA | Posted: 11:25 AM on 10.24.10 |
| ->> The story is about the athlete and his gold medal - not the chicken. Why would they clutter up the caption mentioning it? |
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Dianna Russell, Photographer
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Springfield | MO | USA | Posted: 11:54 AM on 10.24.10 |
| ->> Maybe he wanted his picture taken with it. |
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David Harpe, Photographer
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Denver | CO | USA | Posted: 12:17 PM on 10.24.10 |
->> What sort of contractual arrangement do you have with the bird's creator? Is it royalty free or rights-managed? Or is it a "they'll get more business since I'm promoting their bird so I don't owe them anything" sorta thing?
Model release? Property release?
:-) |
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Bruce Twitchell, Photographer
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Coeur d'Alene | ID | USA | Posted: 1:30 PM on 10.24.10 |
->> How did your stuffed animal get in the photo? Did you put it up next to the gold medal winner?
This all is a bit weird to me that photographers are more concerned/worried about getting photos of their stuffed animals than just getting photos of the athletes/contestants. |
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Joe Cavaretta, Photographer
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Ft Lauderdale | FL | USA | Posted: 2:29 PM on 10.24.10 |
->> let me get this straight... the winner of the event holds up his gold medal on the platform and you hold up a rubber chicken in front of everybody thereby F**ing up everybody's shot, and YOU'RE mad?
I beg to differ, but the gold medal presentation is not an "in-between" moments of waiting and waiting" of this or any event.
They did not include the chicken in the caption because they were completely dumfounded as to what you were doing. |
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Stew Milne, Photographer
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Providence | RI | USA | Posted: 2:44 PM on 10.24.10 |
->> Bruce and Joe: I completely agree.
Downtime, what's that? |
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Stew Milne, Photographer
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Providence | RI | USA | Posted: 2:48 PM on 10.24.10 |
->> Original caption on image is:
"Gold medallist Kohei Uchimura of Japan shows his medal as he is interviewed after the men's individual all-around final of the World Championships Gymnastics in Rotterdam, Netherlands, Friday Oct. 22, 2010. At left is Koji Uematsu of Japan. (AP Photo/Bas Czerwinski)"
Also on www.apimages.com is an alternate photo of the medalist cropped to remove the chicken. |
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Joe Cavaretta, Photographer
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Ft Lauderdale | FL | USA | Posted: 3:04 PM on 10.24.10 |
| ->> does not matter if it is just an interview... for the AP and Japan several hours ahead of Rotterdam, this might have been their only shot at making deadline in Japan with the winner and his medal, a big deal in Japan.. |
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Jim Owens, Photographer
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Cincinnati | OH | usa | Posted: 5:36 PM on 10.24.10 |
| ->> At least he's not choking it. |
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Stew Milne, Photographer
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Providence | RI | USA | Posted: 8:09 PM on 10.24.10 |
| ->> Joe: I was just providing the original caption that went with the photo. We all know the publications often make up their own or shorten them. The chicken was not mentioned in the original caption, and honestly, what would you say? "Here is the gold medalist and someone stuck a stupid chicken in my frame." |
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Sam Morris, Photographer
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Henderson (Las Vegas) | NV | USA | Posted: 10:08 PM on 10.24.10 |
->> Perhaps you would have preferred if the caption read:
"Gold medallist Kohei Uchimura of Japan shows his medal as he is interviewed after the men's individual all-around final of the World Championships Gymnastics in Rotterdam, Netherlands, Friday Oct. 22, 2010. At left is Koji Uematsu of Japan. At right is the result of an infantile gesture by an inconsiderate photographer who placed her toy chicken in the frame.(AP Photo/Bas Czerwinski)"
I enjoy fun and screwing around as the next person, maybe more. But to stick a stuffed chicken up in front of the winner of a competition while others are working is wrong, inconsiderate and shows a lack of judgment on your part.
It's bad enough we have to deal with TV cameras and cable pullers walking through our frame, that just comes with the territory. What we don't need is someone who has no concept of work time vs. play time. |
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Brian Blanco, Photographer
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Tampa / Sarasota | FL | USA | Posted: 10:14 PM on 10.24.10 |
->> Grace,
You started the thread so please respond. Did you hold up the stuffed chicken as the AP shooter was shooting this image or did the subject do it? And why would this subject be holding your chicken anyway?
I can't believe I even had to type the above sentences so, on second thought, do me a favor, if you're ever at an assignment I'm covering... keep your ridiculous stuffed chicken in the car.
Unbelievable. |
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Mark J. Terrill, Photographer
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Simi Valley | CA | USA | Posted: 6:08 AM on 10.25.10 |
| ->> After looking at several pictures from that situation, it looks to me like Grace pulled him aside to pose with the chicken after the medal ceremony was over. There were all the standard pictures of the medal ceremony without the chicken. It's entirely possible that the shooter saw Grace's setup, thought it was funny and shot it. Grace has been around a while. I really doubt that she screwed anyone out of a picture. Quite the contrary. I guarantee that picture wouldn't exist if Grace hadn't set it up. I think you can argue the merits as to whether she should be chummy with gymnasts and pose them for fun pictures, but I think it's wrong to jump to the conclusion that she shoved this thing up in front of everyone. I don't know for sure, but I really don't think that happened. |
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Brian Blanco, Photographer
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Tampa / Sarasota | FL | USA | Posted: 6:36 AM on 10.25.10 |
->> Mark,
The fact that the stuffed chicken is even introduced into the equation at all is what bothers me.
Let's say Grace did pull him aside to pose with the chicken (which I agree is much more likely than the *chicken ambush theory*) well, what might that athlete have been doing if he wasn't busy entertaining Grace? Maybe the AP shooter would have been able to capture a nice frame of the guy showing his metal to his coach or sitting against a wall staring at it and reflecting or hugging his teammates or a hundred other possible candid moments, but instead, he's fooling around with a photographer's stuffed chicken.
Hey, I'll admit it, I have fun at assignments; we all do. I take goofy photos with and of other shooters during down time but never to the point where I influence what's going on. It only bothers me because this year I've been burned a couple of times by photographers doing similar things (or going up and hugging the subject) while everyone is trying to shoot a candid moment on deadline.
Photographers need to keep themselves, and their stuffed chickens, out of the equation ;-) |
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Mark J. Terrill, Photographer
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Simi Valley | CA | USA | Posted: 7:52 AM on 10.25.10 |
->> Brian,
Fair enough. I tend to agree since I've been burned that way as well, but by simply being there we often influence the situation. If you knew an athlete and he or she, upon seeing you, gave you a special look or did something especially for you, are you going to tell me that you wouldn't use the picture because your presence influenced it? |
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Joe Cavaretta, Photographer
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Ft Lauderdale | FL | USA | Posted: 8:42 AM on 10.25.10 |
->> Mark,
No harm no foul... But, who started this thread? And who called into question the veracity of an AP photo caption? (and I don't work for them)
Heck, nobody would have even noticed.... |
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Brian Blanco, Photographer
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Tampa / Sarasota | FL | USA | Posted: 8:58 AM on 10.25.10 |
->> Mark,
You're right. When I shoot NFL for you guys the cheerleaders are ALWAYS giving me, as you described, "special looks"... and I do, indeed, move the photos ;-)
What can I say, apparently I'm 'special'.
-Brian |
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Stew Milne, Photographer
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Providence | RI | USA | Posted: 10:50 AM on 10.25.10 |
->> "If you knew an athlete and he or she, upon seeing you, gave you a special look or did something especially for you, are you going to tell me that you wouldn't use the picture because your presence influenced it?"
Mark, in your scenario the athlete decides to do something special upon seeing you, but in Grace's, she is introducing a prop to the scene. I have worked alongside Grace at many events, but luckily have never seen the chicken or had it show up in any of my photos.
I haven't shot elite gymnastics as long as Grace. Going on six years for me. I am friends with a few of the gymnasts, but I always act like a professional when I'm on the job. I don't give them hugs or even really speak to them during or after the competition, while I might be making photos. If I'm at the arena well in advance and I run across some of my friends, I'll chat and hug, but this is well before I am even considering taking photos.
I see this chicken as a distraction, during time when you should be concentrating on your work. It's just unprofessional. |
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Alexander Pylyshyn, Photographer, Student/Intern
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Newmarket | ON | Canada | Posted: 10:57 AM on 10.25.10 |
->> I don't mean to be rude, but reading this thread in a public place, it took all my willpower to not laugh hysterically.
No disrespect to you Grace...but this is just a bizarre topic. |
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Grace Chiu, Photographer
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Ottawa | ON | Canada | Posted: 3:40 AM on 10.26.10 |
| ->> To clarify, Kohei Uchimura was standing around waiting for Fuji TV. He agreed to pose with Tandoori Chicken, as many of the medalists have. Before I finished shooting, a bunch of other photographers crowded around and started shooting too. Chicken left and they were still shooting, so the AP guy had plenty of other shots to submit without Chicken in it. Unless Uchimura refused to look at him or something... |
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Sam Morris, Photographer
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Henderson (Las Vegas) | NV | USA | Posted: 4:24 AM on 10.26.10 |
->> Grace,
My apologies. I was too quick to spout off. Blame it on lack of coffee, a frustrating weekend, a bad day or just plain stupidity.
I am sorry for impugning your reputation.
Now, I must go find a way to extricate my foot from my mouth. |
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Joe Cavaretta, Photographer
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Ft Lauderdale | FL | USA | Posted: 5:04 AM on 10.26.10 |
| ->> grace, ok. Got it. Wish you would have been more clear in the original post. |
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Sam Santilli, Photographer, Photo Editor
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Philippi | WV | USA | Posted: 10:19 AM on 10.26.10 |
->> My "personal mascot" is a Nikon D700. What is your personal mascot?
Grace, you asked: "where else is this happening in the world?" Probably no nowhere else. It is great you have such a close relationship with the athletes you cover, that is a special bond. But for the majority of us on this site, we do not get to hang 24/7 with our subjects. |
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Dennis Wierzbicki, Photographer
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Plainfield | IL | USA | Posted: 1:56 PM on 10.26.10 |
| ->> @Joe C., shouldn't it be: "No harm, no fowl"? |
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