| Sign in: |
| Members log in here with your user name and password to access the your admin page and other special features. |
|
|
|
|
|| SportsShooter.com: Member Message Board
WIAA sues Newspaper over Internet Feed of HS Game
Alan Herzberg, Photographer
 |
Elm Grove | WI | USA | Posted: 9:30 AM on 03.05.09 |
->> The Wisconsin Interscholastic Athletic Association has filed suit over a newspaper's live internet feed of a HS state tournament football game. Here's the link:
http://tinyurl.com/auxu4o
"We have a right to cover the event" vs. "we have the right to control how an event is covered". |
|
Chuck Liddy, Photographer
|
Durham | NC | USA | Posted: 9:48 AM on 03.05.09 |
| ->> Good luck to the WIAA on that. What a colossal waste of taxpayers money. They're trying to sue Gannett? A huge corporation with busloads of lawyers, yeah this is a smart move. Someone should send some coffee to the folks in charge in Wisconsin and get them to wake up. If that doesn't work just have the media start investigating how much this is going to cost the taxpayers. I just don't get why these high school operations think they have the right to try and insert rules like they are a professional or college entity. |
|
David Harpe, Photographer
|
Louisville | KY | USA | Posted: 9:52 AM on 03.05.09 |
->> It reminds me of the silliness that goes on at concerts these days. Photographers have to fight draconian terms from concert promoters in exchange for two songs from the pit, while hundreds of cameras in the audience go unchecked as long as they don't use a flash. They post them all over the Internet later, and it's all okay.
I wonder if this would change if media properties simply paid for tickets and blogged from the stands? |
|
Clark Brooks, Photo Editor, Photographer
|
Urbana | IL | USA | Posted: 10:38 AM on 03.05.09 |
->> Chuck,
Broadcast rights is what generates revenue for most of the operating budgets these state organizations need. Sports like football and basketball generate an awful lot of needed revenue to keep state organizations healthy and positive.
If a newspaper "broadcasts" or streams a game for free. That will keep true broadcasters, TV and radio, away and will negatively affect the organization;s budget. If every newspaper in the state does that, the WIAA would have no income stream to depend on.
Funny thing is, remember the big bruhaha here in Illinois last year between the Illinois Press Association and the Illinois High School Association? Per a court settlement between the IPA and the Illinois' athletic association last year, a newspaper can do a live feed or broadcast, where as a broadcast television stations, radio and internet only aggregates can not. The legal team for the IHSA screwed up big time IMHO, in their concessions to get the IPA to back off pursuing a remedy via state lawmakers, the agreement states the organization would not interfere with any "newspaper product". It should have been worded differently, but how so that it didn't not include internet broadcast rights is for the legal minds. Effectively, every paper in our state can do live feeds, voice or visual streams - as this would be their 'product' which they created - without paying a licensing fee since organization effectively gave up that right to any entity that publishes a weekly or daily publication per the settlement agreement. Under IHSA rules the *other guys*, traditional broadcast stations still need to pay a licensing fee to carry the game. If someone did this, I'm sure the IHSA would try to stop them and the two parties would find themselves in court again with the one arguing the letter of the agreement and the other the spirit. Who would win, I haven't a clue if it came down to it. I can see the two organizations back in court again in the next couple of years arguing over the settlement and those rights. |
|
Eric Canha, Photographer
|
Brockton | MA | United States | Posted: 10:49 AM on 03.05.09 |
| ->> I just hope that ONE of these state leagues lets this run the full course of the legal system. |
|
Richard Uhlhorn, Photographer
|
Chelan Falls | WA | USA | Posted: 11:03 AM on 03.05.09 |
->> Question??? Why should newspapers be able to live stream video or live broadcast sporting events for free when radio, television and internet companies have to pay for the priviledge. All make their money from advertising.
We are currently broadcasting over the internet from the Washington WIAA State Basketball Championships and are paying a broadcast fee just like radio does, and quite frankly, it is reasonable. Our advertisers are more than willing to help cover our costs for these events because the individuals who are working and can't make the State Championship games until the weekend are the advertisers customers, and they recognize the value of being an advertiser.
During our first broadcast on Wednesday morning, we had 500 listners in our small town of 7,000, some of them grandparents who are still wintering over in Arizona. Our local radio station is also broadcasting the games live.
I agree with Clark Brooks. The WIAA in Washington generates its income from these venues. They don't charge legitimate print outlets for newspaper access to the venues. As a photographer/writer, I have always been given access with the proper credentials at no charge.
Cheers Rich |
|
Corey Perrine, Photographer
|
Hudson | NH | USA | Posted: 11:12 AM on 03.05.09 |
->> "The WIAA is asking a Portage County judge to rule that the organization has the right to "control the transmission, Internet stream, photo, image, film, videotape, audiotape, writing, drawing or other depiction or description" of high school games."
Put away your sketch pads. Sheesh. |
|
Jeff Stanton, Photographer
|
Princeton | IN | USA | Posted: 11:49 AM on 03.05.09 |
| ->> Pretty unbelievable stuff. We've covered these events and publicized them at no charge since newspapers began, yet we have people who want to dictate these kind of terms to us. I say that cuts both ways. Perhaps we should start charging for coverage. |
|
John Petrovic, Photographer
|
Olathe | KS | | Posted: 12:36 PM on 03.05.09 |
| ->> What about the Etch a Sketch? |
|
Chuck Liddy, Photographer
|
Durham | NC | USA | Posted: 12:36 PM on 03.05.09 |
| ->> Jeff, that's a great idea. If only everyone would stick together, but they won't. I would like to clarify the point I was trying to make in the first part of this thread...this is just my personal opinion ans has nothing to do with anything logical...I just think it's wrong that these HS athletic associations are beginning to think they can make the sports they regulate over the state cash cows for their coffers. That's what they are doing. They look at the colleges and the pros and they go, "Hmmmm, we should do that, we could make a lot of money, which in turn we could use to make our salaries higher, hire more people and make our association have even broader power." Where's it going to end?....having parents having to sign a waiver to record (in any medium) their four year old playing t-ball? But, of course by then the PeeWeeTBallOmnipotentAgency will own all the rights to your media. Sorry, someone has to draw a line in the sand. Let these high school associations do what they were created for. Make sure rules aren't violated in the hundreds of schools they oversee. Stop the nonsense in trying to grab the rights of events being played in taxpayer built stadiums, with taxpayer bought uniforms, by kids whose parents (taxpayers) already pay a boatload of money for their kid to play on a team. I hope Gannett gives them a beat down in court. I just feel sorry for the taxpayers who are the one's who will have to foot the legal fees for the rocket scientists who thought suing was a good idea |
|
Kevin Seale, Photographer
|
Crawfordsville | IN | United States | Posted: 12:55 PM on 03.05.09 |
->> Jeff,
What are your thoughts on the latest discussion in Indiana that has the IHSAA being eliminated and their responsibilities rolled back into the department of education?
My opinion is anything that eliminates that political monster is a good thing but also could be missing the bigger picture as a result of my resentment for the current organization. |
|
Eric Canha, Photographer
|
Brockton | MA | United States | Posted: 2:11 PM on 03.05.09 |
->> Guys the hs associations aren't the one trying to change things. Video has existed for many decades, and I'm willing to bet that NOT ONE station or network showed up and plopped down on the baseline and began broadcasting the games without restriction, ditto for radio, they PAY for those broadcast rights.
It's the newspaper industry that is facing changes and it is the newspaper industry that is trying to force those changes on everyone else (at the hs levels).
It seems to me that the one BIG difference is that with TV and RADIO the editorial and entertainment units are well defined and each knows where the lines in the sand are. Newspapers not so much. To the ME at a paper D section is no different from B or A sections. To a TV manager, reporting the final score of a Sox game and BROADCASTING the entire games are well defined DIFFERING packages. TV has no problem understanding that. Newspapers either missed the memo or chose to ignore it.
Kevin if and when IHSSA rolls back to a state agency or any other group (IHSA, MIAA, XYZAA) and the STATES have to foot the entire bill for athletic programs the REAL sh!t will hit the fan. Wait until the STATES have to choke up a few mil to run a year of playoffs and finals. Wait until once this is rolled into a state program, and the LABOR UNIONS get a toe hold....
I don't have an ax to grind with the papers but it is the newspaper industry that wants everyone to bend to their new model not the other way round. All any of these agencies are |
|
Jeff Stanton, Photographer
|
Princeton | IN | USA | Posted: 3:08 PM on 03.05.09 |
->> Kevin, it's not going to happen, at least not this year. The lawmaker who proposed the change withdrew the bill and it's dead for now.
I didn't think it was a bad idea. The schools are supported by the taxpayers and it would seem logical that the association or group charged with overseeing high school sports should also be an arm of the dept. of education. That's just my opinion, of course.
The IHSAA here in Indiana doesn't seem to have any oversight. In the last 10 years or so, it has run roughshod over players, parents and media. Again, my opinion. |
|
Richard Uhlhorn, Photographer
|
Chelan Falls | WA | USA | Posted: 3:24 PM on 03.05.09 |
->> It really depends on what State you are in. In Washington, sports is funded through M&O Levies which the people pay for. The State doesn't really pay squat for extra-curricular activities.
That being said, I have never had a problem obtaining permission from our interscholastic association to shoot photos and write stories. I certainly don't pay for the priviledge.
However on the audio/video side, our WIAA requires a fee per game. I think we are paying $120 per game for broadcast rights.
Isn't that what advertising is for????? |
|
Kevin Seale, Photographer
|
Crawfordsville | IN | United States | Posted: 3:39 PM on 03.05.09 |
->> Jeff,
Thanks for your thoughts. I also thought it seemed like a good idea to gain some control over the free-for-all that has become Indiana High School Sports.
Guess we will have to wait til next year to see what happens. |
|
John Germ, Photographer
|
Wadsworth | Oh | USA | Posted: 3:42 PM on 03.05.09 |
->> I'm with Eric. Other outlets have to pay for the right to broadcast. Newspapers shouldn't get that right for free just because their "special". Of course schools and organizations are making money off it - that's what the newspapers want to do to. Nobody is broadcasting games as a public service. What SHOULD happen though, in a perfect world, is every media outlet has the same opportunity at a contract.
As for newspapers banding together and refusing to cover local sports - you think newspapers are going under now? That local content is your lifeline. It won't be an immediate affect but you'll see subscriptions drying up at a faster rate. |
|
Jack Howard, Photographer, Photo Editor
|
Central Jersey | NJ | USA | Posted: 5:09 PM on 03.05.09 |
->> "Clearly, I guess, we disagree," said Dan Flannery, P-C executive editor. "We are seeking to protect our rights to cover the news in whatever form or with whatever technology we have at our disposal."
Think Mr. Flannery and the Shareholders/overlords at the Gannett MotherShip have the cojones to pull this strong-armed "rights of a free press to profiteer" garner-sympathy-for-us-crap with the Badgers?
Somehow I doubt it.
Think they'll sue to try to start streaming video from the concert at the local taxpayer-supported arena? Somehow I doubt it.
Just because the local Gannett outpost decided to buy some video cameras and decided they are now a multiple-stream and multiple modality "information center" doesn't give them carte blanche to bring their video cameras to any quasi-private event and broadcast away whenever they see fit. By the "taxpayer" logic, these events are taxpayer supported, so how dare they even charge the general public an entrance fee!
"We are seeking to protect our rights to cover the news in whatever form or with whatever technology we have at our disposal." If this is Gannett's logic, shouldn't Gannett shooters be streaming video from Spring Training games, the upcoming Stanley Cup Playoffs, and just about anywhere else a Press Photo credential will get them for "newsworthy" events? Think we'll see Gannett suing MLB, NHL, or even the NCAA or Nascar to cover their events with "any technology at their disposal" any time soon? Somehow I doubt it.
Think the Gannett team would pull these tactics and try to stream video out of a closed courtroom, because the courtroom is taxpayer funded, and they've got the technology at their disposal?
This strikes me as yet another desperation play to gain online traffic/revenue by a company that seems to get farther and farther away from any actual in-depth community coverage with each passing day. How dare anyone stand in the way of Gannett's desire to monetize anything that's easy to slop on a newswebsite without actually requiring too much depth of resources.
Next thing you know, some group is going to claim that Gannett doesn't have the 1st Amendment right to fill up the front page of their community "Information Center" Newswebsites with user-submitted pictures of their pets*, and then there will be serious trouble!
~~~~
*Because pets are cute, and people looooove to look at funny pictures of animals. And when you have people vote on whose pet is cutest: Ka-ching! Clicks and revenues are sure to follow! And the shareholders are happy. And it doesn't require experienced reporters or photographers--at all. And that saves money on staffing, while increasing traffic, so it's a win-win for management. But not really for the readership that expects the local press to pay some mind to local affairs and report on issues and items that matter in local government. On a related topic, I both can and cannot believe not one person on this site had any comment on this article about the state of news coverage in NJ: http://njmonthly.com/articles/lifestyle/whos-covering-new-jersey.html . Here's a thread I started 2 days ago about this article. http://www.sportsshooter.com/message_display.html?tid=32375 |
|
Eric Canha, Photographer
|
Brockton | MA | United States | Posted: 10:16 AM on 06.16.11 |
->> Okay my bad not sure why this popped up in my feed today. I completely missed the date of the filing and that this was the original case and not the result of the appeal.
Sorry. |
|
Eric Canha, Photographer
|
Brockton | MA | United States | Posted: 7:31 AM on 08.25.11 |
->> This time I am looking at the CORRECT update. In a nutshell Gannett lost their appeal. State high school associations have the right to assign/sell exclusive broadcasting rights.
More can be read on the NPPA blog:
http://blogs.nppa.org/advocacy/2011/08/25/wia/ |
|
Return to --> Message Board Main Index
|