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|| SportsShooter.com: Member Message Board
Youth Sports Photography
Ryan Gebely, Student/Intern, Photographer
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Womelsdorf | PA | USA | Posted: 4:47 PM on 09.24.08 |
->> So I am thinking about making the leap on my own but I have some questions for those of you who are doing youth sports photography.
Without going into detail with my business plan I have a few concerns about covering youth sports.
(side note I search the message board a little and didn't find anything so if this has come up in the past forgive me)(Also I am from PA)
#1 When shooting sports such as under 10 soccer what issues have you faced with taking pictures of kids and making them available online?
#2 Are there any huge issues relating to kids that I should be aware of. (Besides the obvious. I am just trying to CMA)
Cheers- |
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Delane B. Rouse, Photographer, Photo Editor
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Washington | DC | US | Posted: 5:14 PM on 09.24.08 |
->> Ryan-
You definitely didn't do a good search (here) and you'll find even more information over here:
http://www.prophotohome.com/forum/
That is the former robgalbraith forum so you'll probably he to go back in time to find the GOOD information.
Delane |
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Ryan Gebely, Student/Intern, Photographer
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Womelsdorf | PA | USA | Posted: 5:54 PM on 09.24.08 |
->> Besides those questions I am looking for general info, things to do and not to do. I am really trying to get a feel from the people who are doing youth sports photography as there main means of income.
*I did a search for youth sports, photo release, youth, etc.. I did not see anything although I am sure it is there somewhere. I appreciate any help thank you. |
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Dave Amorde, Photographer
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Lake Forest | CA | USA | Posted: 6:28 PM on 09.24.08 |
->> 1) - STOP NOW WHILE YOU STILL CAN! This is a VERY competitive market. You better have an extra sharp pencil when writing that business plan. If you really insist...
2) - Take some serious time while you are still in school to do some detective work. Find out what the "other guys" are doing with the various leagues. If they are selling on-site only, buy a print or two and ask why they don't sell online; you might be surprised by the answers. If they don't make sense to you, or you just sense that the people are clueless or lazy, then you have a legitimate opportunity on your hands.
3) - Be prepared to talk to a lot of disinterested board members who already work with another outfit and see no compelling reason to switch. As about past complaints to see if there are areas you can focus on to further separate yourself from the competition.
4) - Be prepared for a LONG lead times for both T&I and tournament contracts. Unless the league currently doesn't offer these services (not likely,) all events for the rest of their season are already contracted out, and the best you can hope for is getting in next season.
5) - Start small. Don't promise to cover a 50-game soccer tournament before you've even bought your equipment and lined up extra shooters. Speaking of which...
6) - Unless you concentrate on individual sports, or selected teams in a league, you cannot do the job by yourself. You need to network with local shooters who aren't too proud to work for a fixed rate. Finding out what the going day-rate is in your area should already be in your business plan.
7) - Do not under estimate the time and money required to market yourself. These people aren't going to come to you. Sometimes you need to yank a few chains just to find out when the league's next board meeting is.
8) - Do not under estimate the need for, and cost of, good insurance. You will need liability coverage for yourself of at least 2mil if you want to cover any indoor events and hang lights. No lights, and you can get by with 1mil while you get going. Make sure your coverage extends to any contract shooters you hire as well - it doesn't matter what your contract with the shooter says, the disgruntled party will come after YOU, not him. DO NOT enter a single field or arena as a working professional without insurance! You will also need insurance on your gear for theft, as well as damage due to weather or impact. Do not expect your or your parents' homeowners insurance to cover professional equipment. While we're on the subject, don't forget to purchase sufficient weather gear and canopies to suit the conditions where you live.
9) - For your very first outting, if you are shooting a team where you don't know anyone, be sure and shoot kids the same sex as you. If you don't, be prepared to deal with questions regarding your intent. You will have a MUCH easier time getting started if you begin a portfolio NOW. Look to sibling, cousins, family friends, etc. to find kids already involved with the leagues you wish to market to. Practice on those kids only your first couple of outtings. Bring prints to following games to give to the respective parent(s). Ask them their honest opinions of what they like and don't like about your photos, and listen very carefully; you might be surprised by what constitutes a "winner" in eyes of Mom and Dad. Also, pay attention to which of the other parents & kids show an interest in your photos, so you can start shooting their kids and getting more feedback. Which reminds me...
10) - Beyond your initial family contact in the league, DO NOT GIVE AWAY YOUR PHOTOS! You should already have your online storefront ready to go, and you can start uploading galleries of the other kids for their parents to browse. At this stage, I would disable any watermarks and insure that the previews are reasonably high-res so that even if the parents don't buy, you can go back to them for some more honest feedback. Later, when you truly "go live", you can turn on the watermarking and shrink the previews if need be.
11) - For at least your first year, NEVER blindly upload a complete shoot to a web gallery. Nothing drives away customers faster than having to skip past photos that are out of focus, are nothing but ref's ass, etc. NEVER LET THESE POTENTIAL CUSTOMERS SEE YOUR OUTTAKES. If you become successful, there will come a time where your daily take is simply too large to screen. When that happens you will have to decide if your sales justify hiring an editor. I would like to suggest up front that the answer should be "yes" as soon as possible. It's tempting to let overall quality slip in favor of a few hours sleep, but that slippage can cost you dearly later.
12) - Put "custom" at the front of your mind and dictionary. Custom artistic treatments - collage posters, "painted oils", custom borders and the like are the real bread & butter of youth sports. Standard orders of 5x7's will cover your expenses, but the real profits come from custom post-production work, so you had better have so solid experience with Photoshop and Painter. Every sport, every league, has its share of "photo whores" who will spend outrageous amounts of money, year after year, to buy every shot of their kid you've ever taken, and they'll pay good money for custom art as well.
13) - If you plan on covering live team events instead of, or supplemental to T&I, seriously consider selling onsite. The impulse buys make it worthwhile, as does your ability to watch and listen as people browse your take. Yes, stuff like file servers, viewing stations, and generators cost money. However, the return is more than worth it for large events, and some leagues won't even talk to you unless you sell onsite. Which brings me to my final category...
14) - Prepare for the "juice." The league is going to want a cut of the action. This ranges from 10-20% of gross sales, and is one of the #1 reasons why leagues insist on onsite sales - they want their cut immediately at the conclusion of the event, or they at least want to know what there cut is going to be before you leave. If you sell online, be prepared to provide sales reports to back up your sales figures. Negotiate a limited period for residuals - no more than 62 days after the conclusion of the event. Send the first check sent out at 14 days, and a second check at the conclusion of the residual period.
Oops, just one more thing...
15) - Make sure your residuals are structured so that you pay against your receipts for either online or onsite sales, but not both. If you decide to sell print online only, you can decide to sell CD's onsite and pocket 100%. If you sell onsite, you can give the league coordinator a check at the end of the event, and further online sales are all yours. Either way, you will effectively cut your juice by one third.
Oh yea - sleep now while you can; once you get going, you'll be losing a lot of sleep for the first year or so! |
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Lindy Dugger, Photographer
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Rome | Ga | | Posted: 9:22 PM on 09.24.08 |
| ->> I don't have any direct experience with this, but a guy I used to work with in school did this mostly with swimming, and his way of solving the photos of children online (and in bathing suits) was to password protect his galleries and just give the passwords to team coaches to pass to parents or sometimes to parents who he talked to directly. Seemed to work well for him, I never heard of him having an problems with it. |
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Phil Hawkins, Photographer
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Fresno | ca | usa | Posted: 9:35 PM on 09.24.08 |
->> Dave,
Wow, tremendous information. Thanks for taking the time to post such a thorough response.
Yes, it is a very competitive market, and one I feel that many times is being served by people who are better at business and prospecting than photography. I would concur with your admonition of being persistent. Just because a group is happy with the relationship now doesn't mean that in the next 10 minutes (literally) something can happen to change it. And when the board starts to consider who to get next, you are at the front of their thinking if you've been in regular contact with quality products and a professional demeanor. The "No" answer only means "No" today, not tomorrow. |
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Clark Brooks, Photo Editor, Photographer
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Urbana | IL | USA | Posted: 10:26 PM on 09.24.08 |
->> Ryan,
I suggest you move to California and work for Dave for a year. AIYSP (Amorde's Institute of Youth Sports Photography) is the best in country. But gotta ask why youth sports photography? Building a decent senior and wedding can be much more profitable on per hour basis. Plus your images would have a longer shelf life. |
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Eric Canha, Photographer
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Brockton | MA | United States | Posted: 11:05 PM on 09.24.08 |
->> Dave what an EXCEPTIONAL post. Seriously good reading.
A couple of points.
On site sales are VERY sport specific in terms of success. There has to be a reason to hold parents at your tent. If you are working a tournament where there is down time between heats/matches etc, people will use this downtime to shop. Setting up at a three-fer Pop Warner Sunday lineup is a bad idea. At least around here, at the end of the mites game the league wants every cleared out to make way for the peewee's. Which isn't hard because the last thing people want to do is hang out in the rain, snow, cold to 'shop'. On site sales of regular season events, at least around here, have alway been lack luster.
Next point to keep in mind is that if you are shooting a team or league for a season, people will wait until either the end of the season or until their team is out of the hunt. Be prepared for so so sales until the end of the season, then BAM! Sales will start flowing in.
Clarke is 100% on the money (no pun). Just as the youth leagues feed the prep leagues, you should be using this as an inroad to build a strong relationship with the high schools and the FAMILIES to market senior sittings and portrait sessions.
I have portfolios of 'athletes' that now range from their peewee game to their (now) senior year playing varsity. Parents will buy those photos now to build scrapbooks for graduation.
Dave's comments about getting good help is also on target. Ask potential contractors to submit to a background check. Unless you KNOW the person you are hiring, they will have access to kids while wearing YOUR logo! It will only take one pervert to ruin your business forever. There is no forgiveness when it comes to peoples kids.
If you want specifics email me off list. |
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Delane B. Rouse, Photographer, Photo Editor
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Washington | DC | US | Posted: 12:23 AM on 09.25.08 |
->> Eric said "Be prepared for so so sales until the end of the season, then BAM! Sales will start flowing in."
I only want to change ONE word...change "will" to "MIGHT".
IF you've done everything else right (made great images, advertise directly to the participants, sent e-blast on a regular basis, AND it's a few weeks before Christmas..." your sales should start flowing.
We do pre-sales to guarantee a minimum interest (i.e. PURCHASE level) on a per game basis. Want to see pictures of little Timmy? Then DAD can go out and shoot every game. Want to purchase pictures of little Timothy? We've got you covered!!!
http://contrastphotography.com/blog/rsvp
We "spotlight" the customers that prepay $25-$20.
They need to get at least three parents per game for us to assign a photographer to an event.
Does anyone else do this?
Delane |
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Delane B. Rouse, Photographer, Photo Editor
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Washington | DC | US | Posted: 12:24 AM on 09.25.08 |
->> That should read:
We "spotlight" the customers that prepay $25-$200
dbr |
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Alan Herzberg, Photographer
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Elm Grove | WI | USA | Posted: 1:25 AM on 09.25.08 |
->> Dave's post was great, great advice. Nonetheless, I will argue for one exception to the "do not give your photos away" rule.
I've found that one effective way to get known at a school I've never photographed before is to shoot a game and then come back a week or so later for another game with 2 or 3 of the best shots from the week before, printed large (8x12 - 12x18) (and be sure to put the prints in a protective sheet). Ask a few people if they can direct you to a parent of the players in your photos. Then, introduce yourself to the parent, provide business cards and explain what you do. Give him/her the photo and explain that there will be more photos to view and purchase online from the week before and in future weeks.
Not only do the parents spread the word to the rest of the team, but the large prints create quite a buzz in the stands. People get to see first hand how good your work is. Most have not seen a quality action photo of their athletes, and if they have, it probably was printed no larger than 5 x 7. I know that nothing generates a bigger spike in views at my website (and purchases) than when I do this.
I'll second Dave's advice about custom art, collages, etc. Doing these things in a creative way can really set you apart from the competition and can generate a lot of additional revenue. |
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Jody Gomez, Photographer
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Murrieta | CA | USA | Posted: 2:59 AM on 09.25.08 |
->> Alan,
My partner Jeff Crace makes custom art from our Pop Warner games and brings them to the field. Except we don't give them away. We sell them at the same price they would be online (without the shipping costs, of course) and we've had no problem selling the images.
We're going to try onsite viewing and preordering this weekend. It's so hard because we're shooting at least seven games every weekend - back to back to back, so there's just no down time to give that personalized customer service.
Finally - no matter how many games we shoot - we still cull the take - meaning we dump the crap and apply a crop in PhotoMechanic (at least) on every image we shoot. We shoot thousands of images between Thursday, Friday (we both have high school football teams as well at separate schools), and Saturday Pop Warner - and we make sure that we see every image we release to our site. It's our reputation that is at stake and taking an extra hour or so on QC is well worth it. |
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Dave Amorde, Photographer
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Lake Forest | CA | USA | Posted: 3:57 AM on 09.25.08 |
| ->> Alan, I do something similar, but not quite. I'll take the best 5x7 from the previous event in the same league, make a 24"x36" collage or digital oil to use as a portfolio sample for the current event or two, and eventually give it to the family that purchased the orginal print. It's gotten to the point where some kids will come up to the table and BEG to be the next "model." Collages are usually given away after one event; digital oils mounted on canvas are usually kept for 3 or more events since they cost so much to produce. |
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Paul Jordan, Photographer
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Rochester | NY | USA | Posted: 7:56 AM on 09.25.08 |
->> I will add that the best marketing tool for me has been bringing a pre-sold 20"x30" or larger poster to a game and MAKING SURE I meet with the parent/purchaser WELL BEFORE the game and any tailgating. They are hugely effective marketers, especially during tailgate time.
Most of them carry the poster into the stands for the game as well.
Invariably I get business from this - I have even had parents in the stands go to the pressbox and have someone walkie talkie a sideline coordinator to "go get that photographer and tell him I need to talk with him".
I have found you can talk all day and all night, post images on the web, etc. but NOTHING leads to more work than the actual physical work itself. |
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Brian Jackson, Photographer, Photo Editor
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San Carlos | CA | USA | Posted: 2:22 PM on 09.25.08 |
->> Need an onsite network of ordering stations? I've got 8-12 to sell you, complete with LCDs :)
Don't undervalue your work. Price your 4x6 and 5x7 the same, your lab charges, what...$0.15 less for a 4x6? People will buy the cheapest thing you offer. Last thing you want to do is spend 2 hours on an order of 30 4x6s that you are only charging $4ea for.
You DO NOT want to be the Wal-Mart of sports photography. Avoid the shoot, print everything as a 5x7, come back next week, hawk for $5 each, or $25 for as many as you want model.
Pre-paid is also a happy way to go. Last thing you want to do is chase the $10-50 print sale...too much work.
Dave's points of custom are correct. Either custom posters (which are actually fun to make), or the bulk DVD of images model are decent.
DVD model works great for Cheerleading type events: $20-25 per person on the squad, everyone gets a DVD [you just need to logistical workflow to handle 50,000-70,000 photos in a weekend: present within 2 -3 minutes after each performance, and organized well]
good luck |
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Osamu Chiba, Photographer
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Vista | CA | USA | Posted: 4:13 PM on 09.25.08 |
->> Regarding #12 in Dave's first post, fellow ss member Chris Rozema (http://www.sportsshooter.com/members.html?id=2192) has interesting stuff:
www.artisticaction.com
I've been using one of his templates for the last few years.
O |
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Jeyhoun Allebaugh, Photographer, Assistant
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New York | NY | | Posted: 9:39 PM on 09.25.08 |
->> One thing you might think about is contacting locally established busy youth sports photographers and having them contract you out.
Photographing pee-wee football is a good, fun way for me to make money on the side, but I don't want it to monopolize my time. The company I contract for (www.efxsports.com), gives me memory cards, I shoot the players who have made orders and then I hand them the cards back at the end of a game and get a check in the mail less than a week later. |
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Kevin Seale, Photographer
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Crawfordsville | IN | United States | Posted: 10:58 PM on 09.25.08 |
->> Dave,
Thanks for taking the time to write such an informative post. Information like this is what I love most about this site.
Thanks again for the extra effort. |
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Sam Santilli, Photographer, Photo Editor
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Philippi | WV | USA | Posted: 12:47 PM on 09.26.08 |
| ->> Ryan, get a good attorney and a good CPA. Also get your business liscenses in order, state, local, city. When a new shooter pops up in y area, I do not hesitate to get out if they have the right creds to be shooting and selling. States are cracking down on online sales companies that are not paying taxes. |
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Paul Alesse, Photographer
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Centereach | NY | USA | Posted: 9:40 AM on 09.27.08 |
->> All great advice here, but here is my take on the situation FWIW...
This is really not a great time to "start" this business. So many are getting out and it's going to get worse before (if) it gets better. You'll be up against the following...
1) More competion as the technology improves and so many are thinking of the same thing you are.
2) There really is a correlation between gas prices and photo sales. As gas prices go up, photo sales go down. Now, correlations never are intended to imply cause-effect. I'm only saying that there is indeed a correlation. And gas prices are at their highest peak.
3) If planning on doing any kind of online business, I will give you this advice... it will not live up to your expectations if you don't couple it with onsite sales. Why? People simply don't have the time anymore. Put it in their laps to buy or build time in their day to view photos and you'll see sales. Leave it to their own "free" time to go online and buy and it will never happen. They simply don't have the time.
4) If planning on doing this entirely as a shooting on speculation action business, you will fail miserably. Once 80%-%20 action/T&I, our ratio is now completely flip-flopped in favor of T&I and this coming from a company that has a solid marketing plan in place, a full line of view stations, a full on site setup, and a complete fullfillment system.
5) More able bodies on the sidelines are not really the problem. The 20D, 30D, 40D, and soon 50D were all right around the same price when they first came out. But... you'd rarely see a 70-200/2.8 attached to it. Well, now we are seeing it more and more. It still doesn't equate to professional photos, but for parents the attitude is... "it's good enough".
6) The economy is really bad right now. Something in their budget has to go. Photos is just one of them.
This post is not intended to discourage you although it probably will. It's just I see and hear from so many that are thinking about doing this because they hear from so many that their photos are really good. Good photos is a solid foundation to a good photo business, but it's really just about 10% of the entire business plan. There's so much more that goes into it and I have only scratched the surface. |
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Sam Santilli, Photographer, Photo Editor
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Philippi | WV | USA | Posted: 12:35 AM on 09.28.08 |
->> Paul, if the economy is so bad...why are there so many D40's with 2.8 glass in the hands of hockey and soccer moms? Are they really saving on that $100 sale to you and me by spending $1,200 on gear they will only shoot with in auto mode? The "photo Mom" is usually my best customer, and is happy to refer business our way.
The market is changing, we need to change with it or die. I do not plan in going away....so I am looking at markets that are not being hammered by everyone else. |
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Delane B. Rouse, Photographer, Photo Editor
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Washington | DC | US | Posted: 12:37 AM on 10.10.08 |
->> Sam,there are a lot of D40's in the sideline because people were going to shoot pictures anyway. They shot film (Nikon 6006, N90s, Canon Rebels) in the 90's and now they are shooting digital.
They started out with point and shoots that cost them $300 then they saw you on the sideline with your big camera that cost you $6000 in 2001. Now a camera orders of magnitude better than that old Nikon D1 at 2.7 megapixels is $1200 and despite the economy, that isn't a lot of money if you think about paying for and processing rolls of film.
I told this story on another post:
"...the GWC (guy with camera) that comes out with his D300 and 300/2.8 and ask why his pictures were blurry even though he was shooting at F11 (another true story)"
I agree with you...we need to change or we won't pay the mortgage. |
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Eric Canha, Photographer
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Brockton | MA | United States | Posted: 9:35 AM on 10.10.08 |
->> "The "photo Mom" is usually my best customer, and is happy to refer business our way."
Gotta agree 100% I've handed a stack of flyers to these photo mom's and when I turned around they were in the stands making sure that every parent had a flyer. This happens over and over. |
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Luke Trottier, Photographer
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Bath | ME | US | Posted: 11:57 AM on 10.10.08 |
->> Here's my 2 cents.
The business of Youth Sports Photography is a BUSINESS and for it to succeed you need to be business minded.
Ask yourself.
1. What can I do to separate myself from my competition?
2. Who should my customers be?
3. How can I market my business to my customers?
Tell yourself.
1. I will need to be patent.
2. I will need to invest my earnings.
3. I will need to be prepared for change.
Regarding the market. The average soccer mom can still afford a $10 5x7 just not a new SUV. |
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Mark Davis, Photographer
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Decatur | AL | USA | Posted: 1:08 PM on 10.10.08 |
->> As a youth sports shooter in Alabama with 26 years experience, I have found soccer tournaments are the least profitable of all sports photographed. The last two state tournaments I covered, and marketed very well, sales were low - Much of that was also due to parents attempting to shoot the official team photos over our photogs shoulder. Is that true in other parts of the country?
Also, have others here considered charging a camera pass fee charged at the gate similar to a cooler pass fee?
Youth Sports a few years ago was well worth the time and I still have a few that are profitable. I would recommend wedding or commercial work for a new business model unless your area has an open market for Youth Sports.
Mark Davis |
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Jim Cayer, Photographer
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Long Beach | CA | USA | Posted: 1:32 PM on 10.10.08 |
| ->> Great information everyone and thanks Dave for that detailed reply. |
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Eric Canha, Photographer
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Brockton | MA | United States | Posted: 5:14 PM on 10.10.08 |
->> Mark,
For me softball is the big black hole. Luke has it right. It's business, and has to follow all the same rules and concepts that any other business follows.
I'm also hearing that some events are just plain banning cameras. One of the women at my wife's office told her that the parents were warned that the use of cameras (still and video) would result in points being deducted from the team and disqualifying the dancer. |
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Delane B. Rouse, Photographer, Photo Editor
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Washington | DC | US | Posted: 5:42 PM on 10.10.08 |
->> Mark said "have others here considered charging a camera pass fee charged at the gate"
I've never heard of such and since I don't own/run the event I wouldn't be able to do that. Of course I like the idea of banning cameras. Most of my hockey rinks don't allow you to bring in your own food so I can see a venue not allowing cameras. How you'd seriously police such without making your patens mad I don't know...
Eric, softball has never been a big hitter (no pun intended) for us. Even when we did the Pony Nationals in Sterling,VA a few years ago we barely turned a profit after we had 2-4 shooter, hotels, computer technicians, runners, equipment, and there were 2 days we couldn't shoot due to rain. Oh yeah, Pony wanted at least $2 per print we sold or 10% (if I remember correctly), whichever was greater.
dbr |
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Mark Davis, Photographer
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Decatur | AL | USA | Posted: 5:50 PM on 10.10.08 |
->> I also thought about having the event host add a fee to the ticket price and then giving that to the official photog to off set losses due to so many parents bringing in camera's.
To police the camera fee, one would have to take the camera to the car or it would be held in the press box until they are ready to leave.
Banning out right would be the simple solution, but that's against the status quo. Something will have to give in order for photographers to be willing to cover tournaments.
Mark |
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Mark Davis, Photographer
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Decatur | AL | USA | Posted: 6:01 PM on 10.10.08 |
->> Delane,
Of course, the event host must agree to the camera pass fee and collect it; that would be worked-out and agreed conditional upon the photographer covering the event.
Since many hosts either want a percentage of photog sales or want images for use in their marketing, they have a vested interest in helping collect the fee. Heck, give the host the fee and let'em keep it. If that would keep other cameras out. |
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Paul Alesse, Photographer
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Centereach | NY | USA | Posted: 10:52 PM on 10.10.08 |
| ->> Delane... we do the East Region Little League Tournament in upstate NY and it's one that does well for us. But, with that tournament, all the stars line up correctly. The viewstations are setup in the ballroom at the hotel where every girl and family stays and we open the doors from 4 PM to midnight which is pretty much from the end of the last game till the pool and lounge closes, which is right across the way from us. |
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Jim Roshan, Photographer
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Bowling Green | Ky | USA | Posted: 3:16 AM on 10.12.08 |
->> Great info here!
I just want to add one more note - to make sure you have a good lab, that understands youth sports, on your side!
Remember - You don't go to a Podiatrist for brain surgery just because their a Doctor!
Stick with the specialist in your field... |
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Darrell Walker, Photographer
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Smyrna (Atlanta) | GA | USA | Posted: 10:22 AM on 10.15.08 |
->> There is a photographer/company going to put tournament photos on a CD for $125.00 per team. They are boasting that pictures can be copied and distributed to all parents. This cut rate photography is really crazy.
http://www.eteamz.com/fastpitch/tournaments/tournament.cfm/1401990/ |
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Richard Orr, Photographer
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Longmeadow | MA | USA | Posted: 10:55 AM on 10.15.08 |
->> All of the advice around here is good.
I will add my two cents. The biggest laugh we get on the sidelines from new guys is that they are never around after daylight savings time, or during basketball season.
They fall off the face of the earth when it gets cold, or when they have to shoot a tough sport.
Get good equipment that can be used at night. Get good rain gear. Know how to light even the crappiest middle school gym and hockey rink.
Learn to be treated like the help. And be prepared to deal with the mom who will never be happy, and the Dad that knows more about your profession than you.
Shooting youth sports is fun until Monday afternoon on a long weekend. When we would do this tournament stuff, my wife would remind me not to look at the kids as athletes, but as little $20 bills waving on the field. Your job is to go out and harvest them. |
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Philip Johnson, Photographer
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Garland | TX | USA | Posted: 11:38 AM on 10.15.08 |
| ->> From most of the responses I have read on this thread I am not sure if you are only doing action photos or T&I or both. If you are only doing the action shots why did you decide not to do the T&I? It has been my understanding that the best profit margin is in the T&I, am I corredt on that? |
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Eric Canha, Photographer
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Brockton | MA | United States | Posted: 11:57 AM on 10.15.08 |
| ->> Phillip --- YES --- |
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