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Odd servo-focusing problem with 1D - Help!

Bob Markey, Photographer

Royal Palm Beach | FL | US | Posted: 2:01 AM on 09.28.07

->> Four weeks into the football season, I am at wit's end to solve a nagging focus issue with my original 1D bodies, 70-200 F/2.8 lenses and 300 F/4 lens.

The bodies and lenses seem to focus accurately and quickly when used in single-shot mode. But when I use them in servo, the cameras seem to struggle to achieve focus and images are frequently back-focused or not focused at all! I notice a lot of back-focused sequences shot during football games.

Sometimes I can feel the camera struggling as I am following a play. For lack of a better description, the camera seems unsure of itself.

At times, it will be dead-on, and then in the middle of a sequence, just fuzz-out, then maybe catch the action again at the end of the play. This happens in 45-point mode and single-point mode. Very few images are dead on as they have been in past years.

It seems like these 1Ds have become the equivalent of a D60, or maybe even a 20D.

I suppose some of these instances could be caused by the contrasty background or someone coming across the plane close to me. But I just noticed this issue starting with the first high school games of the season in late August.

I changed the focus tracking settings from slow to fast and then to medium. I could find no focus speed settings. Finally, I reset the custom and personal settings to the camera default.

One of the 1D bodies had been in for focus calibration with a 20-35 lens during the summer and I had not shot any sports since then. So I assumed CPS might have caused the problem. I tried the body with a second 70-200, and even my 300 F/4 - in daylight and at night - and the issue persisted.

Then I tried the other 1D body and it happened then, too!

I started considering that maybe the shutter button was wearing out and allowing the pressure to decrease, causing the camera to try to refocus during a sequence. But I shot down that idea when I realized the problem occurred in both horizontal and vertical modes.

I considered that maybe it was me. Maybe I was unknowingly lifting my index finger up a bit causing the problem. But it has never happened before and I have been consciously keeping on the pressure this fall.

I have also noticed that at least one of the bodies is taking a longer than usual time to process the images. The red light stays on a while. So, I wondered if there might be a processor problem.

I also wondered about the discs I use (mostly Ultra IIs that have never been a problem).

Finally, I wondered if it could be a battery problem. My batteries are getting old and die more quickly than I would like, and they are mostly the MDD cheapos. They don't fit very well.

I have sent the main body to CPS for a look. The folks there could offer no help over the phone. I hope they find something wrong to fix, or some setting I missed.

In the meantime, I would appreciate hearing about any similar experiences and/or your suggestions to solving this frustrating problem.

Thanks all.

Patrick Fallon, Student/Intern, Photographer

	Columbia \| MO \| USA \| Posted: 1:02 PM on 09.28.07
	->> Try using the * button focusing on the camera... if its something to do with the shutter release.. maybe this can help..

Yamil Sued, Photographer, Photo Editor

	Peoria \| AZ \| USA \| Posted: 1:17 PM on 09.28.07
	->> My MKIIn did the same thing, I had to send it to CPS, they repaired (replaced some fancy stuff I don't remember) and it works great now. I have a feeling that your Body has the same issue!! My body would get the first shot sharp, they go haywire after that!! Good luck

Bob Markey, Photographer

Royal Palm Beach | FL | US | Posted: 11:45 PM on 09.28.07

->> My first assumption was a body problem, but how can I explain the situation happening on two different 1D bodies, on three different lenses?

The bodies were purchased at different times and the one I am using now (while the first body is at CPS) has around half the actuations.

I will try the * button.

I am so bummed because these cameras have (except for underexposing and crummy flash metering) been so good at AF, even in the most challenging lighting situations.

Any more suggestions? I'll report back when CPS gives its word. Th body arrived in New Jersey Friday morning - two days via USPS Priority Mail from South Florida. Pretty good for $12.95 (plus insurance).

Bob Markey, Photographer

Royal Palm Beach | FL | US | Posted: 3:52 PM on 10.04.07

->> I just got off the phone with CPS and one of my 1D bodies is supposed to arrive tomorrow. But I am concerned the problem will continue.

Canon apparently found little wrong with it. A rep told me they cleaned it, including the "magnets", two mirrors and such, and adjusted the focusing mechanism to factory specs.

He said my body has 135,000-plus actuations and I am looking at having to replace the shutter, mirrors, magnets and such around 150k, and definitely by 200k. Cost: $700!

So much for that idea.

The rep said the camera meets specs and is working fine now, so I hope my servo focusing problem is gone. But he also said as the camera ages, it could experience such problems.

My fingers are crossed as I am shooting at least one highs school game and both the FAU-USF and Troy-FIU games on Saturday.

Bob Markey, Photographer

Royal Palm Beach | FL | US | Posted: 2:28 AM on 10.06.07

->> Update:

I got the camera back today and used it tonight at a high school game. It was a nearly a disaster.

Out of 400 or so shots with a 70-200 2.8L, I'll bet no more than 10-20 are in focus, although a number are close.

The body struggles to achieve and keep focus in servo mode, and when it does follow the action, appears to back focus. Most of the time, the player is just OOF (you know, the helmet brand name is just a bit fuzzy), although the pic might be decent enough with a bunch of sharpening for newsprint publication.

It does this with a number of lenses and at least four different CF cards. I use some crummy after-market batteries (just ordered two new ones).

I tried using the star button for focus halfway through the game, and if anything, the keeper ratio was worse (probably because I am not used to keeping the thumb down on that button).

I had the camera pretty much on the default settings, although I set the AF tracking speed to moderately slow halfway through the game. I was shooting with the 550EX on both ETTL (awful) and manual at F/2.8 and 1/320 to 1/400 and ISO 1250.

Please, someone, tell me what's going on. Is this body just worn out?

I'm going to try a friend's 1D at the college games tomorrow to determine whether I have suddenly lost my ability to make in-focus images, really have a problem body (although I think my other body does this, too), or could possibly have three bad lenses.

FRUSTRATION!

Jesse Beals, Photographer

Silverdale | WA | USA | Posted: 3:21 AM on 10.06.07

->> Hey Bob,

HUm, first thing i would do is set your focus to the * button. Then I would set your focus inside the eye cup (Red square) screen to just the middle setting. It almost sounds like your camera is picking the best focus point inside the focus graph even if it's not the main subject.

I also would try adjusting your lens settings on the lens body.

If none of these solve the problem then maybe you should send all your gear in at once so canon can trouble shoot the problem.

I shoot all my sports with 1D's their work horse camera's.

jes

Bob Markey, Photographer

Royal Palm Beach | FL | US | Posted: 11:40 AM on 10.06.07

->> Do you mean the diopter adjustment? I have that set to meet my far-sighted eyes. But the images seem sharp in the viewfinder, just not in the images.

By lens seetings, do you mean have Canon tweak the lenses to the body(s)? I have the 70-200 F/2.8s and 300 F/4 set to the farthest focus setting (I have tried the closer one also). Other than the AF on/off button, that's all I can see.

I did try the * button. No help.

It is going to cost me a fortune to send in two bodies, and at lease three lenses for checkout.

Thanks again.

Thanks.

Jesse Beals, Photographer

Silverdale | WA | USA | Posted: 10:25 PM on 10.06.07

->> Bob,

Try this first. On the 70-200 adjust the settings from 1.5M too 3m on the lens take a few shots and see if thats the problem.

if that doesn't solve the focus problem then try this on the camera. The square that is nect to the * icon on your camera hold that down and spin the top dial. Look into the camer to see the highlighted red squars. I am wondering if you have it set at AF with the square box setting. I would chanage it to the middle setting SEL square by turning the dial. I have all my 1d's set at this setting.

If this doesn't work then you got me?

Bob Markey, Photographer

Royal Palm Beach | FL | US | Posted: 7:18 PM on 10.07.07

->> I'm not sure what you mean by "AF with the square box setting". I have shot with both 45-point auto and center focusing point settings.

At the first college game yesterday (USF at FAU in daylight at Lockhart), the camera could not manage to achieve proper servo focus most of the time and would just fuzz out in the middle of a sequence.

So, I borrowed a friend's 1D and thought I was doing much better (did not notice any really obvious issues), but later after viewing the images, even that camera was not right. I used the same 300 F/4 on each body.

Late in the game (with borrowed body) I switched to the 70-200 2.8 and started noticing the problem, such as a sweep coming at me with the runner not quite in focus (but useable), then then fuzzing out completely before coming back into almost focus.

At the second game, I used only the 70-200 (night game, Troy at FIU in the Orange Bowl). The results are awful, with only a handful of a couple of hundred images in focus, and even those close to in focus are not sharp.

I tried some borrowed CF cards (I had some problems with a couple of mine) to rule them out as a problem. No difference. I even tried a borrowed battery. No difference.

If the problem is the lens, I find it very odd that two other lenses would be equally as affected. I should have had my friend use my lenses on his MKII to rule them out, but we were not near each other for much of the games.

I guess I need to send the main body and two or three lenses to Canon. I just wonder whether CPS has the technology to test a camera with moving subjects.

Thanks.

Jesse Beals, Photographer

	Silverdale \| WA \| USA \| Posted: 1:59 AM on 10.08.07
	->> Hum, do you have moisture in your lens? You got me. If the images are still out of focus on a different body I wonder if your lens has mositure inside it? I guess hold it up to a light to check. jes

Bob Markey, Photographer

Royal Palm Beach | FL | US | Posted: 3:58 PM on 10.14.07

->> No moisture to my knowledge. The views are sharp and the lenses were just cleaned and adjusted.

Update:

For the second consecutive week (and third time for the body), I sent my 1D to CPS - this time with the two main lenses (70-200 2.8L and 30 F/4L). CPS was extremely helpful and prompt in servicing the items. I dropped them off with the FedEx driver at 6 p.m. Monday and had them back in my hands at 3:30 p.m. Thursday.

In the meantime, I again spoke to a phone rep, who said they were being checked to make sure they were properly adjusted and met factory specs. No one could get into detail with me and the paperwork offered no specifics of the repair other than clearing and adjustment.

For the second time, I had send CPS poorly focused images on a CF card. No mention was made of them to me.

Well, Thursday night's first use of the freshly serviced lenses and body amounted to another disaster. The 70-200 and 1D appeared to be "trying" harder at keeping images in focus, but later on the monitor, most sequences were not quite in focus, which some images way out and others close enough for newsprint use but generally back focused (or so it appeared). I tried 45-point and center-point, and focus tracking ranging from slow to fast.

On Friday, same thing.

On Saturday, with no college games to shoot, I hit the youth football fields. Again, well composed runners and players filling most of the frame were not properly in focus. A very few images were nice, but I got the feeling they were lucky grabs while the focus happened to be close enough as the shutter fired.

I once owned a D30 and D60. This 1D (or the lenses, or the after-market batteries, or the CF cards - if any of them could be the problem) is acting in servo mode like it is one of those lesser technology models. I know my 1D can perform much, much better. It has for years until this fall.

Canon, despite its good customer service, is not getting the problem fixed (or at least not testing the items) and I'm at a loss as to what step to take next.

Jesse Beals, Photographer

Silverdale | WA | USA | Posted: 6:00 PM on 10.14.07

->> You got me. Maybe your batteries? but that would be a stretch. When Canon had your gear did you talk to the tech working on your gear while it was in their hands?

I know I had to do this one time with my extender.

This sounds like a nightmare, if all else fails maybe try a different camera repair shop. Have you had anybody try your lenses on their bodies? Have you tried shooting your camera body with somebody elses lenses to figure out if it's the body or the lenses?

Jes

Bob Markey, Photographer

Royal Palm Beach | FL | US | Posted: 6:39 PM on 10.14.07

->> At first I was sure it was the camera (possibly even something like a worn out shutter button spring or something like that, but the body has the problem in both portrait and vertical modes). But then I did use my 300 and 70-200 on a friend's 1D. I did not notice much of a problem at first, but as night fell, I did notice the servo AF struggle and the images were mostly trash.

What would be the odds of two different lenses having the same problem?

So, I sent the camera back with the two lenses. Everything was returned supposedly fixed, but I was not allowed to speak with a tech person, despite numerous requests.

I fear that Canon's benchmark computer is telling the techs all is well, but in real use (servo sports), something is still wrong. I wonder how and if this problem will ever be fixed without gutting the camera.

The batteries are not very good, but they last for a 100 to 200 or so clicks. When they get low, I can hear the camera drive strain at bit, but that happened even with Canon batteries.

I even wondered about CF cards, but was told by a few computer people that the cards (which I have reformatted several times after a couple of the produced corrupted files) could not be the problem. Besides, I also used a friend's cards and the problem continued.

I just looked at some servo images I made of halftime at a high school homecoming game Friday. Many images of the slow-walking court candidates (in dresses and heels, so they can't be much of an AF challenge!) are not quite in focus. So, the problem is not just with fast-moving, erratic subjects.

Thanks for the responses. I'll be back on the phone tomorrow with CPS. Maybe they will tear it apart and give me a loaner in the meantime. I do need a body for next weekend.

Al Goldis, Photographer

	East Lansing \| MI \| USA \| Posted: 11:43 AM on 10.15.07
	->> Bob, just to be thorough, I really think you need to try it with a good battery. The batteries you have now are totally shot.

Bob Markey, Photographer

	Royal Palm Beach \| FL \| US \| Posted: 3:41 PM on 10.15.07
	->> I have some batteries on order. But I did use a friend's battery last weekend, with no improvement. CPS says the battery should not be a reason for this issue, unless somehow the batery was losing contact with the camera, and then the camera would just lose power. The last time CPS had the body, I sent one of my batteries with it. The items are going back to CPS today. Thanks.

Bob Markey, Photographer

Royal Palm Beach | FL | US | Posted: 3:50 PM on 10.30.07

Charles Baus, Photographer

Palm Springs, Los Angeles | CA | USA | Posted: 7:48 PM on 10.30.07

->> I would ask to use someone elses 1D and see if you still have a problem....or else let someone else use your 1D and lenses for while and see what happens. You need to eliminate user error at this point since CPS has had your cameras and lenses looked at.
I always use the center AF square which is what Jesse recommended but I think you already tried that. I also use the * button too for focusing that way if a player hops in front of the player you are focusing on you can release that button and not focus on the wrong player.

Also check out SI's website for their recommended settings on the 1D, good place to start to make sure you don't have something funky setup on yours.

Bob Markey, Photographer

Royal Palm Beach | FL | US | Posted: 12:41 AM on 10.31.07

->> Thanks. I'll try the star button more.

I am so frustrated because I have used this body for years and know what it can do. Its focus abilty seems to be limited to that of a D60 or 10D. It just won't keep up like it used to in servo mode. If it were a person, I would say it was old (135k actuations) and was running out of "gas".

I usually follow the SI settings, but will double check them.

Here are more examples of how the AF just loses it ...

No. 1 Sequence:

http://www.palmswestpress.com/images/FAU_vs_ULM_1a_10_27_07/e39b9160_std.jp...

http://www.palmswestpress.com/images/FAU_vs_ULM_1a_10_27_07/e39b9163_std.jp...

http://www.palmswestpress.com/images/FAU_vs_ULM_1a_10_27_07/e39b9164_std.jp...

http://www.palmswestpress.com/images/FAU_vs_ULM_1a_10_27_07/e39b9165_std.jp...

Another sequence (out then in):

http://www.palmswestpress.com/images/FAU_vs_ULM_4c_10_27_07/e39b9786.htm

http://www.palmswestpress.com/images/FAU_vs_ULM_4c_10_27_07/e39b9787_std.jp...

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