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|| SportsShooter.com: Member Message Board
Night Football
Matthew OHaren, Photographer
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Harrisburg | PA | USA | Posted: 9:52 PM on 10.19.06 |
->> Many of us shoot are shooting a lot of night games, such as football and soccer during this time of the year. Now as far as shooting high school or professional sports, we all have to deal with the low light situations. Lately, I've been shooting a lot of high school football games on Friday nights and just wanted to get an idea what settings we all use in order to capture the action on and off of the playing field. Here is what I'm shooting with:
-Canon 20D (w/ Battery Grip)
-70-200mm f/2.8L IS (Mainly use this lens at night during the game)
-100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS (Use this lens just before sundown for long distances, such as across the field, etc.)
-580EX Speedlite Flash
Now here are the settings that I use. The shutter speed may change as well as my ISO depending on the event venue.
ISO: Ranges between 800-1600
Shutter Speed: 1/250 - 1/320
Aperature: f/2.8
Flash Output: -2/3 - +1/3
AF Point: Center
Just thought I'd share what my settings are for most of these night football games. Now here are my fall backs to a few of my settings that some of you may elaborate on if you would like. I like to shoot on a higher ISO to be able to not only illuminate my subject, but to be able to have my backgrounds lighter as well. No sense of having the subject, such as a running back illuminated and then nothing in the background, such as the field. I'm also wondering, do many of you shoot on f/2.8 to allow more light to enter the lens? Or do some of you stop it down to around f/4 to allow more depth of field, because with an aperature of f/2.8, that defensive back gunning to bring down the quartterback my be out of focus, but the quarterback may be really sharp, even though they may be only a foot or two away from each other on the field at the time the shutter was pushed. I notice sometimes the lighting at a high school stadium may be pretty good that I can shoot with high spped sync past 1/250 and shoot at 1/320 and sometimes 1/400. I do notice though that when the stadium is bright and I'm shooting at 1/250 or 1/320 at f/2.8, that I'm sometimes blowing the players out just a tad with my flash, so I sometimes have to minus (-) out power on my flash. I do get worried by doing this because because by minusing power out of the flash, that now brings down the range that the flash can cover from the side lines to mid-field. Does anybody else run into the same situation or have an tips that can be useful? |
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Marshall Wolff, Photographer
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Framingham | Ma. | USA | Posted: 10:16 PM on 10.19.06 |
->> Matthew,
I usually shoot 250@2.8 with a canon mark 2N. I use a TTL cord from my camera and attach it to a 580EX and then attach that to a superclamp and attach that to my monopod about 2 feet under the lens. This will reduce the chances of red eye. It won't get rid of them completely, but it should work pretty well. It sends the light under the helmet. I shoot with a 300 2.8 but if the play goes to the other side of the field I don't bother. I try to shoot tight. My flash is on -1/3 to -2/3. My picture style is on neutral. My focus selection is on the one right above the center so it's on the players face, which is the most important. I haven't yet tried fast flash sync. Lighting is pretty poor around here.
Hope this helps
Marshall |
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Drew Buchanan, Photographer, Student/Intern
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Fort Walton Beach | FL | USA | Posted: 10:57 PM on 10.19.06 |
->> IF you can use an mk2, I would shoot at 3200iso @ 320th. Flash just seems REALLY unnatural to me, and it is. The noise is nothing if you expose right--looks like 800iso or less on a 1D(original) or D2H.
If I remember, the ISO on the 20D is pretty darn good too...unlike AF. You could probably get away with 3200 and not have to use flash...or very little flash. New print sucks up the grain pretty good so you can get away with it(noise) if you're shooting for a paper.
"Shooting lower than f/2.8 at a night game?"
...funny!
Even with the bad lighting we usually find at prep games, I still like the atmosphere better than pro/college games.
Can't wait 'till soccer season starts! |
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Matthew OHaren, Photographer
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Harrisburg | PA | USA | Posted: 11:08 PM on 10.19.06 |
| ->> Thanks Marshal & Drew. I forgot to add that I shot in AI SERVO Mode (for action) and I also shoot single frame because of the flash and the time to recycle. Do anyof you guys use and external power source or just the flash itself? Thought of getting an external power source to help reduce the recycle time, but have been worried about saving up for a Mark IIN (YEA!) |
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Rodrigo Pena, Photographer
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Palm Desert | CA | USA | Posted: 11:58 PM on 10.19.06 |
->> Hi Matthew, I just thought I'd share what I'm doing. Some fields where I shoot are very dark and some are very bright. My last prep football game I was shooting ISO 1600 with a Mark II N, 300mm f/2.8 on one body, 70-200 f/2.8 on another Mark II N, and a 24-70mm f/2.8 on my 20D. The field was very bright. In fact, the brightest football field in my area. Shutter speed: 1/400th, aperture: 2.8.
I could have shot at 1/500th, but wanted to get a tad more detail in the shadows. Great light.
On darker fields, I shoot as follows:
ISO: 1600-3200 (depending on how bad the light really is)
Shutter 250-320th
aperture f/2.8
I hardly ever shoot at f/4 I need the extra speed to stop the action.
In really dark fields I sometimes use flash on one body and none on the other. Having two different styles gives me variety, but not consistency.
Flash is set to -1/3 to -1 depending on the results of the night. Sometimes -2/3 is perfect, sometimes it's a bit hot and I'll go to -1 or even -1 1/3 if the players are really close to me.
For shooting the far side of the field: unless I have really good stadium lights, it's a lost cause. |
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Aaron Nagata, Photographer
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KEALAKEKUA | HI | USA | Posted: 1:17 AM on 10.20.06 |
->> Greetings Matt, Marshall, Drew, and Rodrigo
I too like you folks shoot at HS stadiums/fields with poor lighting. I shoot with both a 20D and a 1D Mark II with its iso pushed to 3200. I do not use any flash. For shots on the far side of the field, I'll use my 400 mm 2.8. This lens also allows me to shoot tight at mid field. I've found panning to help make better, clearer pictures. My camera setting is on AV therefore letting the camera choose the shutterspeed. Another approach is taking shots from the end zone out. That way you have light on both sides of the subject with their faces lit just enough to see who's running the ball. Shooting in low light is hard especially if the players uniforms are dark. Lightly colored uniforms appears to allow better pictures.
Good Luck to you folks, thanks for sharing your techniques and settings
Aaron |
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Travis Haughton, Student/Intern, Photographer
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St. Charles | IL | USA | Posted: 3:17 AM on 10.20.06 |
->> RE: http://www.sportsshooter.com/news/1485
Impressive catch by the Mira Costa receiver. Especially with a 'paparazzi style' burst of six flashes in his face from close range. |
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Patrick Murphy-Racey, Photographer
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Powell | TN | USA | Posted: 11:47 PM on 10.20.06 |
->> I just shot a high school game tonight her ein Knoxville... Here is an image from the game...
http://pmrphoto.com/pmr.fulton.jpg
this image is 10" wide at 200 dpi, so it might take a bit to load. It was shot with a 30D and a 200mm f/1.8 at just 1000 ISO at a DARK high school here in town.
I see a lot of fill flash on High school games and I've just never liked that look. The EF200mm f/1.8 allows you an effective field of view of a 320mm f/1.8, which is just perfect for many night-time high school sporting events. I can usually shoot at 1/800th or 1/640th if they're close to the lights, and then 1/500th midfield. I use a 135mm f/2 on a 1DMII to cover the end zones. Note that I'm shooting the 30D as my primary body for high school sports. The 1.6x conversion really helps me to keep from cropping too much vs. the 1D's 1.3x conversion factor. |
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Nic Summers, Photographer
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Mount Prospect | IL | USA | Posted: 10:29 AM on 10.22.06 |
->> I like and prefer the color saturations when using a flash. Also, it gives you more depth of field.
Here I combined 2 photos from same play and was shot with a 1D 2N and Quantum T5D with telephoto reflector and 400mm from a platform next to the pressbox door.
If I remember correctly it was shot at 1000iso, f5.6, 1/250th
http://www.sports-star-photos.com/td.jpg |
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Gary Slickman, Photographer
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Natick | MA | United States | Posted: 6:44 PM on 10.22.06 |
->> Nic
Nice images, especially getting them at both ends of the same play.
What time of day were they taken? I am amazed at the lighting so far from the play. It's so even and doesn't apperar to fall off at all. The lighting at that field looks like an NFL stadium compared to the high school fields in MA. We generally have to shoot wide open at 2.8 at 1600 or greater, especially to get a little shadow detail away from the play.
The angle you use seems to clean up the backgrounds but I am surprised by your desire to have greater depth of field. most guys seem to favor contolling the point of interest with shallow depth of field. |
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Nic Summers, Photographer
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Mount Prospect | IL | USA | Posted: 7:59 PM on 10.22.06 |
->> Thanks Gary. I cut this from Photo Mechanic ..ISO: 1000 Aperture: 4.5 Shutter: 1/250 Exp. Comp.: 0.0 Flash Comp.: +1.6 They were taken at 7:36pm in the Chicago area Sept. 1st. Sunset was at 6:25pm that day and there was a little bit of after glow remaining.
I was unsatisfied with the limited DOF and soft photos at the low f-stops in low light that you get in high school sports especially in this dungeon(to use a popular term). I read an article by Hanashiro-san ... http://www.sportsshooter.com/news/1532 ... where he was shooting hockey in Torino. It talked about stepping down the f-stop a little for clearer pictures. Of course the farther you are away from your subject your DOF area is larger also..
The only thing bad about shooting from the press box or from high up is it really cuts down on seeing the faces of the players but not in these 2 pictures. There is a little bit of red-eye in the receiver. The flash bulb centered only about 10 inches off the top of the lens gives bad red eye. There's an adapter to raise the flash up some but the dang thing is about $100 and would really cut down on mobility.
The flash duration is long and combined with the reflector dish, the flash seems extra bright. Only one game did the ref ask me to not shoot during the play but I just moved off the field with a 600mm and kept shooting.
The drawback to using this flash in Q-TTL mode, which is Quantums version of E-TTL using an exposure module mounted in the hotshoe and plugged into the flash, is slow recycle times. If you take off the QTTL adapter and plug straight into the camera in TTL mode, you can get much quick recycles.
Also in regards to depth of field, if you think about it, parents that will buy out of focus shots of their players they are not really concerned too much if I am shooting 2.8 or 5.6 or even higher.
Wow.. now we have AUTO spell checking on this forum.. that's pretty good code writing or whatever it is... |
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Bryan Hulse, Photographer
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Highlands Ranch | Co | USA | Posted: 10:36 PM on 10.22.06 |
->> I shoot High School Football with a D2X and have 2 SB-800's mounted via superclamps on my monopod. I mount my SU-800 remote commander on a flash bracket on the D2X to fire the remotes. Why use the SU-800? So I can quickly take it off, and put an SB-800 on the flash bracket for the half time festivities. I do flip the bracket down so there is a more direct line of site between the SU-800 commander and the SB-800's.
I shoot at 1/400 @f2.8. Originally, I was shooting at 1/500, but 1/400 freezes the action just fine and gives me a little more distance since I am using FP mode (high speed flash sync).
I either vary the power output of the flashes, or change the iso from 800 to 1600, as the players get near or far.
So far this setup has been working great and I can basically shoot all the way across the field using this setup with a 300mm f2.8.
I've asked some of the players that I've flashed at pretty close range, and they didn't even know I was shooting them.
I've been on the other side of multiple flash setups like this and, when in the heat of action, don't even know you are being flashed.
When the players are close, I even dial down the flash output to 1/4, which on the SB-800's has a super fast flash duration (I'm sure that's true with all such flashes).
I have TONS of samples of this setup. But I've been so busy, I haven't had a chance to update my Sportsshooter gallery with any yet.
Oh, and both my XP desktop and XP laptop died this weekend to take even more of my time. (OK, ok, we'll start the 'Get a Mac' topic on another thread).
Cheers from Denver,
Bryan... |
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Nic Summers, Photographer
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