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|| SportsShooter.com: Member Message Board
New Adobe app to take on Apple's Aperture
Delane B. Rouse, Photographer, Photo Editor
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Todd Corzett, Photographer
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Livermore | CA | USA | Posted: 6:17 PM on 01.06.06 |
->> Anything to keep me from needing to buy a new laptop... but then again there are rumors of the Mactel laptops as well. I guess I'll just have to wait until Tuesday to see it for myself.
-Todd... |
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Matthew Rosenberg, Photographer
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Philadelphia | PA | United States | Posted: 8:16 PM on 01.06.06 |
| ->> I just hope Aplle doesn't piss off Adobe to the point where PS goes PC only. When Apple developed FCP Adobe pulled Premiere from the Mac platform. |
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Paul W Gillespie, Photographer
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Annapolis | MD | USA | Posted: 11:37 AM on 01.07.06 |
| ->> What's it going to cost and is designed to replace photoshop and bridge? I have not used Aperture and do not know much about it. It seems from my brief exposure to it to be a combo of Photo Mechanic and a PS lite? Is this assessment wrong? What will this program and Aperture do that PS and PM does not? I have just been using Adobe Bridge to view and convert my RAW and have not had a problem (it is a bit slow in the preview dept.). I would like an ingest feature that can batch caption like PM. |
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Greg Ferguson, Photographer
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Scottsdale | Az | USA | Posted: 12:12 PM on 01.07.06 |
->> "...replace photoshop and bridge?"
No.
"...to be a combo of Photo Mechanic and a PS lite?"
Most likely reduced-feature versions of PM and PS.
I'm not holding my breath for the new Adobe app or for Aperture. The Photoshop and Photo Mechanic teams will not hold still just because there are new kids on the block. They'll keep adding new features. Adobe has an advantage that they can salvage/reuse code from PS in the new app, but they'll have to reinvent the PM side of things as Bridge doesn't completely duplicate what PM can do.
Photo Mechanic and Photoshop are a very powerful combo. Adobe might be hoping to duplicate that combination in a single application, but to do so they're going to throw away features from both apps to create a single smaller app.
Adobe has some advantages over Apple and CameraBits though. They have very good programmers, with years of good code to pick through. Their task is to blend the correct mix of features together to get a winning app.
I'll play with the open-beta demo when it ships to see what it's like first hand, but I'm don't expect it'll lure me away from the PM -> PS work flow. |
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Greg Ferguson, Photographer
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Norm Yee, Photographer
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Fremont | CA | USA | Posted: 3:15 AM on 01.09.06 |
->> "I'll play with the open-beta demo when it ships to see what it's like first hand, but I'm don't expect it'll lure me away from the PM -> PS work flow."
Lightroom isn't meant to replace PS. If anything it will likely replace Camera Raw for many of the photogs in need of better workflow & tighter integration w/PS. Think of it as Camera Raw on steroids :)
and as Greg noted, the beta version is available for download now (though only for Mac). Windows support is coming but not until later this year |
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Larry Vaughn, Photographer
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Greg Ferguson, Photographer
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Scottsdale | Az | USA | Posted: 9:18 AM on 01.09.06 |
->> I'm using the beta now - and it looks very good.
It doesn't replace PS for photo manipulation. If you need to tone or adjust contrast or crop it does fine. If you need to push or move pixels around then you need Photoshop.
The interface is REALLY nice - very intuitive. Watch the flash demo on the page listed above to get an idea of how intuitive it is.
I have many years experience programming for the Mac and am very sensitive to apps that work the "Mac Way". LightRoom is designed very well.
I loaded it on the iBook last night, and we watched the demo and kept telling each other, "Ohh, that's cool!" |
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Robert Irvin, Photographer
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Neptune | NJ | USA | Posted: 8:24 PM on 01.09.06 |
->> Greg..
I have to agree with you. I downloaded it and have been messing with it tonight after watching the video. Seems to run fairly quick on my older G4.
Bob |
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Pete Lorence, Photographer, Student/Intern
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Loughborough | Leicestershire | UK | Posted: 9:55 AM on 01.10.06 |
| ->> Just playing with it now, am quite pretty impressed! Lots of nicce little features, only problem is that the pictures take an age to load on my lil 12" Powerbook. |
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Delane B. Rouse, Photographer, Photo Editor
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Washington, DC & Seattle | WA | US | Posted: 3:35 PM on 01.11.06 |
->> Overall...the interface is sweet. It's faster than Aperture and Adobe admits that this is a beta, unlike Apple charging $499 for US to beta test their product. They probably have to charge $499 to offset the cost of having a heavy hitter like Heinz Kluetmeier (rewnowned sports photographer) "endorse" the product.
Anyway...while Lightroom initially imports the thumbnaile really fast, it's s-l-o-w to produce the full screen images (6-13 sec per image); as a matter of fact there are times when I just don't know what the program is doing i.e. the "Checking Library Thumbnails" message in the upper right hand corner. What the heck is this actually doing?
Im my opinion, the strongest and most complete solution is the PhotoMechanic/PhotoShop combo; PM is VERY fast, allowing near instant preview of full screen images. It ingest/imports images faster than Aperture or Lightroom. We all know the capabilities of Photoshop when it comes to image editing....
Aperture/Lightroom does beat PM when it comes to having a "slick" look (user interface), but when it comes to productivity it's a no brainer. PhotoMechanic is so far ahead it's not even funny. I like it that way. The CameraBits crew is the best when it comes to support and I want to continue to see them dominate the Image Browser field the way the have done since I entered this business...
Also, keep in mind, I DO NOT SHOOT RAW images; for my business of capturing images it is just a waste of time, wasted effort, and wasted hard drive space. I can not comment on any of the RAW capabilities of either (Aperture/Lightroom) of these programs.
I want to "like" Aperture and/or Lightroom but what I really want is to get my job done more efficiently. PM+PS is the best solution out there for me at this moment.
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Apple 17" PowerBook; OS X 10.4.4; 2GB RAM
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Oscar Sosa, Photographer
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Jacksonville | FL | USA | Posted: 9:49 PM on 01.11.06 |
->> I must have a different version of Lightroom than what you guys have. This thing is pretty useless: Takes forever to load, dumps the files into a library, only opens Photoshop CS2 for editing (completely ignoring my preferences), very limited image controls, I can go on all night. Not impressed. It'll take alot more than this thing to get me away from the PM-PS combo.
I am interested in iPhoto '06. Anybody played with that yet? I liked what I saw during the keynote address when Jobs used the program. Might get a copy of it this week. |
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Greg Ferguson, Photographer
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Scottsdale | Az | USA | Posted: 10:10 PM on 01.11.06 |
->> "Takes forever to load"
Mine loads REALLY fast on an iBook 14", It was 5 seconds from clicking to the screen display with thumbnails. But, I'd been using it about three minutes before so it might have been in cache still. I've been impressed very time I load it though.
Since this isn't even a golden-master, but instead is a beta-1, I think it's pretty fast for being full of debugging code and it'll get faster as they fine-tune routines and remove debugging code and turn on compiler optimizations.
"dumps the files into a library"
Only if you told it to. You can also tell it to use aliases of existing files if you want to keep the images on a separate drive. Or tell it to copy the files over as jpegs, TIFF, or Adobe's new(ish) .DNG format as a backup of the originals. In other words, it works however you tell it, but it'll build its own cache of meta-data and thumbnails so you can use it to browser the thumbnails even when the images are offline - like when you're traveling.
And, BTW, it does not use destructive edits - everything is stored as a series of actions so the original image is not folded, spindled or mutilated.
"only opens Photoshop CS2 for editing (completely ignoring my preferences)" The default is to open PS using CMD+E. The menu allows you to choose the alternate. I'm sure they'll add another entry/keypress.
"very limited image controls"
It has an ability to tone, sharpen, adjust shadow detail and correct white balance in an image non destructively. The edit performed on one image can be pasted to all other images.
It FTPs, it creates web galleries, and this is just its first week of being released as a test version.
Instead of telling SS members what you don't like, talk to the developers on Adobe's forum and tell them so they can add the issues to their list. |
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Delane B. Rouse, Photographer, Photo Editor
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Washington, DC & Seattle | WA | US | Posted: 10:14 PM on 01.11.06 |
->> Oscar- is this what you see when you import files?
http://contrastphotography.com/lightroom.jpg
u have the option (pulldown menu) to jsut reference to files (leaving them where they are on your hard drive)
Also...the initial thumbnail generation (for me) is BLAZING fast!!! |
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Delane B. Rouse, Photographer, Photo Editor
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Washington, DC & Seattle | WA | US | Posted: 10:18 PM on 01.11.06 |
| ->> hey greg...say you're in the "Library" view...and you hot Apple/Command-W...does that QUIT the program for you? It does for me...I thought the program was crashing but it's not...it's just the same as quit. |
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Steven Georges, Photographer
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Long Beach | CA | USA | Posted: 11:21 PM on 01.11.06 |
->> Delane-
You're right, Lightroom IS s-l-o-w producing full screen images. Then again, it's a beta. Then again-again, I think Adobe's refusal to support Core Image is going to hurt Lightroom.
Also in response to Delane, if you are not shoot raw, then there is really little point in spending money on Aperture. |
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Oscar Sosa, Photographer
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Jacksonville | FL | USA | Posted: 11:43 PM on 01.11.06 |
->> Ok,OK,OK,OK,,, I went back & started searching for all the stuff Greg and Delane posted in reply to my post. I stand humbly corrected.
I took an overexposed (2 stops) dig image from my 20D and made it into a useable file in about 5 minutes.
I'll play with this program some more, but right now it looks like something I can really use as an all-in-one app. for journalism work.
It's still loading pretty slow. Took about 2min 40 sec to load 6 photos into the library. |
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Oscar Sosa, Photographer
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Jacksonville | FL | USA | Posted: 12:20 AM on 01.12.06 |
| ->> How do I get to the FTP and web gallery screens Greg mentioned? |
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Darren Whitley, Photographer
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Maryville | MO | USA | Posted: 1:12 AM on 01.12.06 |
| ->> I had a hard time buying into Apple's marketing. I prefer Adobe's well designed products so I haven't any intention of buying Apple's product. |
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Greg Ferguson, Photographer
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Scottsdale | Az | USA | Posted: 1:26 AM on 01.12.06 |
->> Yes, the Adobe video is important to show some of the integration that isn't obvious doing it hands-on.
The FTP and web gallery are available in the Slide Show ... go to the Slide Show, select a couple photos, then open the "Slideshow:Export Slideshow" menu. They can be saved as HTML, PDF or Flash. I haven't tried them yet, and heard there was some problems using PDF and Flash so, if they don't work, consider them place-holders for the functionality. |
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Greg Ferguson, Photographer
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Scottsdale | Az | USA | Posted: 1:35 AM on 01.12.06 |
->> "I think Adobe's refusal to support Core Image is going to hurt Lightroom."
Adobe intends to make this a cross-platform application, so relying on an Apple-only architecture like "Core Image" means having to support an alternate code base on the Windows side.
And, just because it's an Apple technology doesn't necessarily mean it's the best for Adobe, or even the best implementation for the Mac. Thomas Knoll, who wrote Photoshop, and who's behind Lightroom is sure to have his reasons for picking the libraries he did. |
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Delane B. Rouse, Photographer, Photo Editor
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Delane B. Rouse, Photographer, Photo Editor
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David Meyer, Photographer
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Orlando | FL | USA | Posted: 9:29 AM on 01.12.06 |
->> I posted this link in another thread, but it looks like this one is gaining momentum so I'll post it again here.
There are 12 tutorial videos on the NAPP site regarding Lightroom.
http://www.photoshopuser.com/lightroom/index.html |
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