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|| SportsShooter.com: Member Message Board
Alien Bees and Honda EU Generators, ever use the combo?
Justin Kase Conder, Photographer
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Fresno | CA | USA | Posted: 3:54 PM on 10.31.04 |
->> I want to buy a Honda generator to use with my Alien Bee strobes but I’m having a tough time determining which generator of two to get. I’m deciding between the Honda EU1000i or the EU2000i, which each put out 1000 watts and 2000 watts.
I currently have three Alien Bees, two 1600s and one 800 and I anticipate purchasing another 800 in the near future.
I would like to be able to run all four lights off of the generator at full power if needed although it’s doubtful I would need to so very often. What I need to know is if I needed to, could I.
I would prefer to buy the EU1000i, considering its lower cost, size and weight but am not sure if would fit my needs.
So if you have any experience with this combination of equipment your input would be appreciated.
Thanks, Justin Kase Conder |
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Mike Mohaupt, Student/Intern
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Grand Forks | ND | USA | Posted: 4:13 PM on 10.31.04 |
->> OMG! Justin your alive?
Why dont you consider the vagabond system? I'm sure its going to be cheaper. http://www.alienbees.com/vagabond.html?item=V300
With a generator your going to have to rember gas to run the thing.
Just a thought.
~Mike Mohaupt |
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Justin Kase Conder, Photographer
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Fresno | CA | USA | Posted: 4:30 PM on 10.31.04 |
->> Shouldn't you be flying pallie...
I've actually considered the Vagabond system but paying a few extra hundred bucks purchasing the generator would allow me to use it anywhere I go for a variety of things besides just my strobes...
Thanks for the suggestion though amigo.
JKC |
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Caleb Simpson, Photographer, Assistant
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Dallas | Texas | USA | Posted: 9:08 PM on 10.31.04 |
| ->> Justin I shoot with a guy who uses both generators and they both work great. We run two of the smaller ones and one larger one when we in fact have to use them. Off those three, we are running 12 lights most of which are 1600 and a few 800's. Mos of the lights are white lightning and a few are alien bee's. I think you would be fine with the smaller one, but may want the larger one just because you will most likely add more lights in the future and need to run more than just your lights off the generator. I hope this helps. |
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Dave Amorde, Photographer
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Lake Forest | CA | USA | Posted: 11:22 PM on 10.31.04 |
| ->> The Vagabond system has a couple of things going for it. For starters, it is super clean AC power that will also run laptops, printers, and other on location equipment. In addition, it will not void the warranty on your Bees or White Lightnings. |
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Justin Kase Conder, Photographer
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Fresno | CA | USA | Posted: 12:00 AM on 11.01.04 |
->> Thanks for the info guys.
As far as the clean power is concerned as long as you get one of the newer "i" versions of the generator (i = Inverter) they both put out clean power. The only drawback that's been brought to my attention so far about going with a generator is that you can't take them on a flight, even drained, because of the fuel remennts.
JKC |
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Paul Kelm, Photographer
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Plzen | Czech Republic | Czech Republic | Posted: 5:45 AM on 11.01.04 |
| ->> Have you given any thought to using gel cell batteries with an inverter? You could make your own power pack. One disadvantage is, as you said, you don't have a genterator for other jobs later on. |
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Brian Jackson, Photographer, Photo Editor
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South San Francisco | CA | USA | Posted: 4:50 PM on 11.01.04 |
->> While I haven't run strobes off of it, I own the EU2000i and it works like a charm. Fairly quiet and produces very clean power.
The most I've run off of the EU2000i is 2 servers(shuttles with AMD XP 2600+), 2 17" LCDs, 6 workstations(Compaq SSF Deskpro EN: PIII), 6 15" LCDs, 1D battery charger, 10/100 switch, fan, printer, 2-way radio charger and an external firewire drive. Ran for about 5 1/2 hours with all of that before needing more gas.
Justin, you can always hit your local contractor equipment rental place and pick up the EU1000 for like $25-35 a weekend. |
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jeff martin, Photographer, Student/Intern
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wellington | OH | usa | Posted: 6:54 PM on 11.01.04 |
->> I've run my 2 AB800s of a coleman 2500 gen. with no problems. I'd like to have the honda...much quieter but I got the coleman for $100 used.
Jeff |
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Jon Blacker, Photographer
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Toronto | ON | Canada | Posted: 8:11 PM on 11.01.04 |
->> Justin,
I've been intending to reply to this thread since I saw it, but haven't been able to find this information until now.
Based on the lights you're planning to use, you should be aware that according to this, neither of those two generators is big enough. This information comes from KHB Photografix, who is a factory-authorized service facility for, among others, Lumedyne and White Lightening. They also service Balcar, Speedotron, Bowens, Broncolor and Elinchrom.
In and of itself, this is not normally a problem, other than sand, dirt and moisture that can cause issues. What does tend to be a problem is choosing a generator that is too small for the pack, which leads to either very slow recycling, and in some fairly common cases, a major failure of the main charging circuitry of the pack. This occurs when the generator is working at its maximum output to supply the demand of the pack, and when the pack suddenly reaches full charge, the generator momentarily continues the current flow, causing the circuit that controls current input to fail. To avoid this problem, Kevin Brown at KHB Photografix recommends that you always select a generator at least double the output of the pack. A 5000 or 6000 watt generator will then work comfortably to power a single 2400 w/s pack, with little fear of damaging the charging circuit.
Makes sense to me.
I have never had any dealings with KHB, but they are the go-to lighting repair shop for one of our local rental houses. Their number is 905-670-5166. Give them a call if you have any further questions. |
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Dave Prelosky, Photographer
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Lower Burrell | Pa | US | Posted: 10:47 PM on 11.01.04 |
->> To add to Jon's post above,
I'd suggest looking to the Furman Sound series of AC power conditioning devices - they're the standard in touring music and audio rigs which are even more sensitive to power problems than electronic flash packs.
This equipment is designed to prevent voltage sags, spikes, and eliminate noise in input power. There are a batch of models with assorted features and the model you select will vary according to current draw of the devices you intend to operate and the front panel readouts you care to monitor.
If you rent generators and the local supplier sends out something that may be better described as a portable welder with 120V Ac capacity, this could be the difference between shoot or not, repair or not, or possibly profit or not.
You'll need to find a pro audio dealer to consult with, but here's the link to get you started
www.furmansound.com
As a futher aside, anoyne using electrical service they're not familiar with should have an outlet checker in their kit. Knowing if wiring is reversed, or grounds are open or mis-wired will add to the safety level of location shooting. It's really cheap insurance, and you can find one in the electrical department at Home Depot for about $5. |
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Clint Keller, Photographer
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Fort Wayne | In | USA | Posted: 9:51 AM on 11.02.04 |
| ->> I have the Honda 1000 and I use it with my two Speedo Force 10's with no problems at all. I love the setup for the price. BTW you can also run a blender for margaritas when tailgating and run your computer when the power is out at your house. Try that with a vagabond.... |
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Al Goldis, Photographer
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East Lansing | MI | USA | Posted: 1:39 PM on 11.05.04 |
->> If you use White Lightning or Alien Bees lights, I think the release of the Vagabond has made generators undesirable.
The battery system is lighter, cheaper, totally silent and doesn't need gas, oil or engine maintenance. Also, the way the Vagabond/WL/AB system is designed, you can use a virtually unlimited number of lights, although the recycle time increases with each additional light. A couple Vagabond 150s (to improve recycle time with multiple lights and/or to place lights a large distance apart without extension cords) should still cost less and weigh less than a decent generator. |
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Clint Keller, Photographer
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Fort Wayne | In | USA | Posted: 5:05 PM on 11.05.04 |
| ->> Al, I see what you are saying, and I have a vagabond. But the one thing that scares me is using batteries and always worrying about whether they are charged and how long they will last. An really, if you have seen the Honda 1000i', they are barely bigger than a vagabond and don't weigh too much more either. I really think two vagabonds would be bigger and weigh more than one honda. Noise is not really an issue either. I put my honda on 50 foot extension cords and I can't hear it much at all. |
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Clint Keller, Photographer
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Fort Wayne | In | USA | Posted: 5:08 PM on 11.05.04 |
| ->> Also, I hooked up a 400 w/s Dynalite UniJr and fried the inverter in my vagabond, yet my 1000 w/s Force 10 Speedos will work fine with the vagabond. The generator would run both of those lights easily and my dynalite 1000 w/s packs also. I guess its a question of convenience vs reliability and diversity. |
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Justin Kase Conder, Photographer
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Fresno | CA | USA | Posted: 6:57 PM on 11.07.04 |
->> Alright so as great everyone's ideas were about getting the Vagabond, I have many other uses in mind for the power and I'm not interested in one. I was however able to borrow a Honda EU1000i from my pallie and SS member, Mike Isler.
Early Friday morning, I powered up the generator and threw my three Alien Bees on it. (Two 1600s and one 800). With the generator running with the Eco Throttle off, I was able to power all three of my lights at maximum output. The two 1600's took three seconds to recycle, while the 800 took 1.5 seconds. Coincidentally that is about the same amount of time the lights take to recycle when they are being powered on my household ac.
So... there you have it, three Alien Bee lights can be run off of a Honda EU1000i generator.
Justin Kase Conder |
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Al Goldis, Photographer
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East Lansing | MI | USA | Posted: 3:51 PM on 11.09.04 |
->> Based on the specs alone, the EU1000i should be able to handle only one light. You can probably get away with using more, but according to White Lightning, gradual damage to the lights will result. White Lightning makes Alien Bees and the power requirements should be the same. Here is a section from the White Lightning FAQ (ignore the 5,000/10,000 Series numbers):
"A portable ac generator is rated by continuous load output, peak output during maximum load, and whether or not its output is voltage regulated. For use with our flash units, a generator must supply at least 165 Watts (W) per White Lightning 5,000 or 10,000 Series unit, and 660 W per Ultra, UltraZAP and X-Series unit (continuous output). The output of the generator should be voltage regulated. Peak output should be at least 195 Watts per White Lightning 5,000 or 10,000 Series unit and 1040 W per Ultra, UltraZAP and X-Series unit. This higher rating is required because a generator cannot specifically increase its output current level at a given point, and must generate a higher output voltage level to accommodate peak power demands. If overloaded, a generator may produce a 'clipped' ac waveform, or apply an output voltage greater than 130 Vac to the flash unit(s). Over time this will damage the equipment. It is therefore good practice to have the generator able to provide over and above the combined maximum peak needs of the lighting setup."
On the other hand, Alien Bees are cheap enough that they're almost disposable. ;-) |
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Kevin Saitta, Photographer
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Groveland | CA | USA | Posted: 2:53 AM on 05.20.05 |
->> get a battery backup and hook it up to the generator.
Get the AVR battery backups... |
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