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Credentials for High School Sports
Jason Hirschfeld, Photographer, Photo Editor
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Norfolk | VA | U.S. | Posted: 9:35 AM on 10.05.07 |
->> I shoot primarily sports for The Virginian-Pilot, a 300,000 daily and the paper has a strong emphasis on High School sports. With it being football season, I'm getting an increasing number of parents and just people in general on the sidelines taking pictures and constantly approaching me to ask "how much does a lens like that cost" and "why are all my pictures blurry". I try to be professional and courteous, but last week I just finally reached my breaking point and told one lady "I don't mean to be rude, but I have a job to do and the game is tied with four minutes left". She gave me the "hrumph" and walked away.
My point for writing this is, I have a friend in the VHSL, the Virginia High School League. The governing body for High School sports. I know some states have adopted a credential policy for High School sidelines and I've been talking to my friend in the VHSL to see if our state can adopt such a policy. It's entirely in the baby stages right now.
I don't mean to sound like a snoot, I've just grown tired of random people on the sidelines that don't have a real reason for being there. Should I relax and suck it up or should I be confident in my footsteps of trying to get a policy adopted? After all, the VHSL does require sideline passes for the playoffs so, why not the regular season... |
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Eric Canha, Photographer
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Brockton | MA | United States | Posted: 10:02 AM on 10.05.07 |
->> Jason,
First be careful of what you wish for.
Second, I don't know about VA, but in MA the MIAA has no authority in granting access to the fields of each school hosting an event during the regular season. Unlike the NFL or NCAA, the MIAA or I'm betting, VHSL doesn't actually have anything to do with the 'regular' season contests. They only sponsor, own, put on, get involved, with the post season. |
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Michael Proebsting, Photographer
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Barrington | IL | USA | Posted: 10:07 AM on 10.05.07 |
->> I would think for no other reason it would be advantageous for the schools not to allow alot of the miscellaneous sideline crowd would be one of safety, or more directly to prevent a lawsuit. I shot a HS football game Saturday, and among other things about 12-15 feet from the playing field were:
A guy in a wheelchair.
4-6 year olds running around.
People with point and shoots walking up to the sideline to get closer.
In today's age, with everyone so lawsuit happy I couldn't help but think if anyone of these people got demolished on the sidelines, how fast would lawyers and litigation be involved?
As far as how to handle people, I think a big part of being "professional", is to act in a professional manner even when other people don't.
It really takes more effort to be rude back to someone, than to be pleasant, plus you never know who you may be speaking with. I look at situations like these as marketing opportunities. That lady with the point and shoot asking questions might be the booster club president who holds the key for some nice opportunities for yourself. |
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Michael Granse, Photographer
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Urbana | IL | USA | Posted: 10:26 AM on 10.05.07 |
->> This is just part of the environment in which we work. Statasticians, assistant coaches, certain players that have practicaly ZERO chance of getting into the game, cheerleaders, and parents watching the game from the fence probably think that WE are the ones always getting in the way. This might come as a bit of a shock, but high school football games do not happen because of photographers. If we stay home, two teams are still going to play the game.
The person who asked you the "blurry photos" question might have waited until there was 4:00 left in the game because it took her that long to work up the courage to ask The Almighty Professional what she probably feared would be seen as a stupid question.
We can take these opportunities to educate people, not only in the art of photography but in the business of photography. It would not require a 45 minute lecture on ISO, Aperture, Shutter speed, bad contracts and how to avoid them, and other topics to help someone in this context.
When this happens, we should tell the person "I would love to help you with your photos but I have to finish this assignment," then hand the person your business card and encourage them to email their question to you. If they send you an email (most people probably won't), write back a short note and include links to some of your favorite photography sites. A link to Sports Shooter should be first :)
You never know when the next "clueless person with camera" is going to buy a very big lens and start giving their photos away. If we catch them early, we can prevent them from making mistakes that lower the rates for everyone. |
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Bryan Hulse, Photographer
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Highlands Ranch | Co | USA | Posted: 10:44 AM on 10.05.07 |
->> Here in Colorado, you are supposed to have a CHSAA pass (Colorado High School Athletic Association) to gain any field access for football. Most of the stadiums I have shot this year require that pass when I roll up with my Pelican case. However, there are still lots of parent photographers on the field during the game. I see boosters and members of the coaching staff letting them past security.
It is silly really. During the game, I am asked for my pass several times, yet there are parents and students on the field taking photos during the game. There are also kids of the coaching staff playing games and throwing the football on the sidelines.
It’s not like these aren’t big games either. And it is only a matter of time before a kid gets creamed by a player.
Most of the parent photographers are nice though and respect my time.
Funny: One guy uses an on-camera flash for night games, with the diffuser dome, and pointed up in the bounce position. Go figure! I want to ask him if he is bouncing off the stratosphere. I've been meaning to get a photo of that guy. |
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Mark Buffalo, Photographer
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Lonoke | AR | USA | Posted: 10:52 AM on 10.05.07 |
->> Jason,
In Arkansas, the only time we get credentials is for state and regional tournaments/playoffs. However, a few schools I've been around have asked to see my paper credentials or have given me a field pass.
I know what you mean about people asking questions. But I do my best to help them. In fact, there are two people who help me with pics when I can't be at a certain games and I showed them how to use their cameras!
And like Eric said, "Be Careful What Wish For!"
Mark |
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Jason Hirschfeld, Photographer, Photo Editor
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Norfolk | VA | U.S. | Posted: 11:28 AM on 10.05.07 |
->> Mark,
That's exactly the way it is here. Passes for the playoffs and it's nice because it really works in that capacity. It weeds out the people that don't have a legitimate reason for being there other than getting a picture of their son. Also, I'm not an ass, I've been dealing with this for a long time (as we all have). I'm almost always courteous, like I said. I just reached my "end" last week. We'll see how tonight goes :-)
Bryan, I think I've seen that guy here too :-) Last week there was a guy with a 70-200 on a monopod using a cable release... I don't know, maybe he suffers from Carpal Tunnel or something.
Michael, "The Almighty Professional"? I don't know if you were taking a shot at me or not, whatever, but if it took her that long to work up the courage to talk to me, than why not at least wait until a time-out or some sort of break in the action...??...
My guess is-it won't change anytime soon. Not until a coaches son or like Michael said, a guy in a wheelchair gets plowed.
Bryan, is your CHSAA pass for the regular season or playoffs? |
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Michael Proebsting, Photographer
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Barrington | IL | USA | Posted: 11:41 AM on 10.05.07 |
->> Jason,
No, my comment was in no way questioning your professionalism in this situation, in fact your response was appropriate under the circumstances, sorry if it came across that way. |
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Jason Hirschfeld, Photographer, Photo Editor
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Norfolk | VA | U.S. | Posted: 11:45 AM on 10.05.07 |
| ->> Michael, no worries... |
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Eric Canha, Photographer
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Brockton | MA | United States | Posted: 12:02 PM on 10.05.07 |
->> Jason,
I understand where you are coming from, but I don't think that you will have any luck cleaning the sidelines anytime soon. Just for this post I decided to pull the numbers on one of the local booster clubs. In the last 2 years they have pitched in $108,500. Face it they OWN the sideline if they want to. I seem to remember seeing a wheelchair/scooter at the Jets/Patriots game in the end zone . People who you and I think shouldn't be there will always get access. The flip side to all this is that when credentials are required and one is denied then the schools get blasted from the other end.
One of the things that I have started doing at some of the games is to simply put my Ipod buds in. I'm not playing anything on the pod but nobody tries to strike up a conversation with me when they think I can't hear them. I had one official walk up to me to complain about safety and I let him in on the 'secret'. He just nodded, smiled, and walked away. Social engineering at its best :)
Peace. |
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Michael Granse, Photographer
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Urbana | IL | USA | Posted: 12:11 PM on 10.05.07 |
->> Absolutely no "shot" intended, Jason. The Almighty Professional in this context would refer to anyone who would be seen by the average person as covering the game as part of their profession. The anxiety that people might feel about approaching The Professional is not the result of the professional's personality but the result of the professional's position.
Here in Central Illinois the blurry photos conversation would have started with a genuinely friendly "Excuse me sir, I really hate to bother you with this but . . ."
This might not be the case in other parts of the country, or for that matter even in other parts of this state :) |
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Mark Buffalo, Photographer
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Lonoke | AR | USA | Posted: 12:19 PM on 10.05.07 |
->> Jason,
I hope I didn't come across as rude towards you. I know how it is with other "photogs" especially when shooting weddings and my aunt always likes to butt in when I'm shooting family weddings!
Good luck tonight.
Mark |
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John Tucker, Photographer, Photo Editor
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Cordova | TN | USA | Posted: 2:54 PM on 10.05.07 |
| ->> One other thing to be aware of.........that person that is "in your way" or the point and shooter asking questions may hold the key to your next money making opportunity....I landed my best paying job by taking time to show a point and shooter why they got blurry photos.......I shoot a lot of team and individual photos and have seen more and more parents bringing their cameras, camera phones, and every other digital device to picture day.............I encourage them to "get your shot" when I see this............it always makes them appreciate my shots more when they get them.........jmho |
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Jonathan Castner, Photographer
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Longmont | CO | USA | Posted: 3:41 PM on 10.05.07 |
->> Here in Colorado credentials mean more at some venues and with some sports. The state sports association does back the media up but except for playoff games the head of the venue and referees are the final call. When I see people or kids who are in dangerous places I simply tell the police on hand and they take care of it. If someone is being a jerk who isn't credentialed I also tell the police that that person isn't credentialed and they handle it.
I don't care that people are there with their point 'n shoots. They just about always get out of my way and are almost never a problem. I don't mind talking shop to them to a degree but will cut them off if I have to concentrate.
Football is the worst in terms of sideline detritus. Last week at I was at a game and about 6 feet from the sideline near the 10 yard line was, I'm not making this up, a man and woman having a pick nick with their toddler. Blanket on the ground, cooler, plates with snacks ... the works. |
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Jesse Beals, Photographer
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Silverdale | WA | USA | Posted: 3:48 PM on 10.05.07 |
->> Jason,
Here in Washington state (Kitsap County) the sidelines are pretty much open like what your saying you have. But I found that by contacting the local football refs and letting them know who is a working professional and who isn't it can get you a better access to the field.
I take 8-10 photos at each football game of the refs in action and at the end of the year I give them a CD with around 200 images of the refs basically just standing on the field. They use the photos for their end of the year party and In return they give me full access all the way around the field up to the out of bounds line and make sure parents and fans with camers stay at least 5-10 feet back or away from the out of bounds lines.
They know I am a working professional and that if a parent or fan gets in my way from me doing my job I can't get the photos I need of the game and shots of them in action so they take pretty good care of me. I might spend 2 minutes max at a game shooting all 8-10 refs and 90% of the time there just standing on the field. |
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Bob Markey, Photographer
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Royal Palm Beach | FL | US | Posted: 4:25 PM on 10.05.07 |
->> Being approached by people interested in bettering their photography skills should be the least of your problems. Think of their qustions as a compliment to your skills.
You are the face of your newspaper when in the field and even if you have to swallow hard a couple of times and smile, it is in the best interest of your publication and your profession to be a bit more custoemr friendly.
I would hope to save my less-than-enthusiastic reponses for the really nasty folks who complain about that controversial picture in yesterday's paper, or the slant of last Sunday's editorial. :) |
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Ron Holman, Photographer
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Visalia | CA | USA | Posted: 2:05 PM on 10.08.07 |
->> I work in a small city with just five high schools- four public and one private. Each of them has folks on the sidelines for various tasks. Among them are the students given the task of photographing the game for school publications. I wish more of them would ask for advice.
I'd be glad to give it. And I'm sure most of those who ask have had to build up the courage to do so. If "can you help me?" comes at a bad moment, I just say "Sure, but gimme a sec for this series, okay?" Understanding and appreciation has always followed. I also hand out business cards with my e-mail and an open invitation for follow-up questions.
The same goes for the adults. I often see these these same folks later, off the field, when I need help with information or access. We have a very helpful community and this is one way I can give a little back. |
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Russ Isabella, Photographer
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Salt Lake City | UT | USA | Posted: 2:52 PM on 10.08.07 |
| ->> Jason: I understand your point, and I too have been on high school sidelines packed with parents, students, coaches from other sports, kids, etc. (Hell, I've been on NCAA Div I sidelines that aren't much better.) But think of it another way. What are they (the parents, friends, coaches, etc., of the players on the field) getting from your being there? At best, one or two photos in the paper. Okay. But how does that compare with the enjoyment they are getting from being on that sideline while their son/boyfriend/student/friend plays the game? High school really is for the kids, and you aren't going to keep their parents away (fortunately). That doesn't mean they belong on the sideline, I agree. But I also can see why they want to be there, why they're allowed to be there, and why I wouldn't expect them to look up to or defer to you, or to believe that you have any more right to be there than they do (quite the opposite, I'd imagine). Controlling those sidelines would take a lot of fun out of the season for a lot of people. This is an issue that's independent of safety, I know, but my point is we're talking high school football, which is about the kids and not so much about the professional photographers who just happen to have credentials. Coexist. |
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Tom Morris, Photographer
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West Monroe | LA | USA | Posted: 3:51 PM on 10.08.07 |
->> This season has been interesting for those of us covering West Monroe High School. Not only do we have all of the above, but we've got ESPN and about 10 cameras doing a documentary/reality/production, which will start airing in mid-November. They shoot EVERY game EVERY week like it's a major production . . . at $10mil estimated budget I guess it is.
http://www.thefutoncritic.com/news.aspx?id=20071002espn01
The high school does a good job of requiring sideline passes and you see very, very few parental point-and-shoots on the WM side, and a just few with the visitors. There is literally standing room behind the ropes around the stadium, so I try my best to kneel when possible. I find myself one of the few, however.
Now if we can do something about all these mini-dv video folks. . . . ;)
tm |
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Jason Hirschfeld, Photographer, Photo Editor
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Norfolk | VA | U.S. | Posted: 4:47 PM on 10.08.07 |
->> Russ, I'm glad you agree they don't belong on the sidelines... I guarantee you though, when one parent (like the one in a wheelchair mentioned above) gets plowed because they're chimping, there will be a rule of some sort handed down.
On the other hand, it's the opposite of what you said about one or two photos at best in the next day's paper.
Our area has produced NFL'ers like Deangelo Hall, Michael Vick, Bruce Smith, as well as MLB's Ryan Zimmerman, David Wright, Mark Reynolds, Justin and B.J. Upton and on and on and on. With that being said, our paper devotes a ton of space to high school sports, so in addition to "one or two at best" in the paper, we're also under pressure to deliver around 5-10 quality images for an online slideshow.
My fuse has been a little shorter this year because of that, mainly because I don't have the time to talk with every parent that has a question. I do in fact hand out cards and tell them if they have any questions to just e-mail me. I also speak at high schools in the area as well as a couple of college photography classes.
My point is, I'm not unwilling to help out, I just think that the sidelines don't need every mom and pop with a camera jockeying for position.
Tom, I heard about that ESPN production... I'm looking forward to seeing it. |
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Russ Isabella, Photographer
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Salt Lake City | UT | USA | Posted: 4:50 PM on 10.08.07 |
| ->> Jason: Thanks for providing a bit more information about your situation. I'm definitely sympathetic. |
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Jeff Barrie, Photographer
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Indianapolis | IN | USA | Posted: 5:25 PM on 10.08.07 |
->> There have been a couple of times when I felt "crowded" on the sidelines and I found the easiest way to get away from it was to go over to the visitors sidelines. Less people, in fact a LOT less people.
Personally I don't mind talking to people during the game the only thing that bothers me is when the get in the way as a play goes further downfield and they step out on the field in front of my field of view. |
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Vincent Johnson, Photographer
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Chicago | IL | USA | Posted: 1:52 AM on 10.09.07 |
->> I'm dead set against credentials in high school sports until everybody from the school & state associations to the papers & photos editors can all get their S@#! together and be on the same page.
First the schools are a community and they will always have a few former players, or parents of players, or boosters who the coaches & ADs will give sideline access to. Especially in the regular season. Even that mom with the disposable point & shoot. Come to Illinois and shoot the state finals when one of the Catholic League schools are playing at the University of Illinois, with professional paid field security, there are still a dozen guys on each sideline, getting in your way, they're no more a part of the coaching staff than the guy in line for hot dogs, but they have passes. And who do you think gave it to them. The same people that will let them walk onto the sidelines once a state wide credential system is in place.
Second, until HS sports starts bringing in the money for papers like Pro sports, no editor is going to take the time to call every school each time a freelancer is going there to put him on a list. And because very few freelancer will ever get a pass from a paper, this is another pain in the a$$ that would come from it. For both teh editor & the freelancer.
Third, states Assc. are already looking at saving money. printing up a bunch of un-traceable press passes so joe "photo" doesn't have to put up with joe "guy in my way" isn't going to happen. They already want us out of their way so they can make money selling photos that we normally take. |
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Jody Gomez, Photographer
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Murrieta | CA | USA | Posted: 2:13 AM on 10.09.07 |
->> "There have been a couple of times when I felt "crowded" on the sidelines and I found the easiest way to get away from it was to go over to the visitors sidelines. Less people, in fact a LOT less people."
I agree. I regularly shoot from the visitor's side. I prefer it, actually. More room to move around, plus you great sideline reaction shots of your team (if they're home).
I am asked something by someone at every game. I don't mind - just the opposite. I love it because I learned a hard lesson very early in my career. At my very first assignment I was having trouble with something (I don't remember what now) and I asked a fellow photographer (who was wearing the same credential as me) for some advice. He was so rude to me that I was humiliated and embarrassed to the point that I got tears in my eyes. The worst part about the way I was treated is that I asked my question during a break so it wasn't like he was going to miss a shot by talking to me. I vowed then and there to never be rude to anyone who asks me a question if I can help it. |
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Joe Nicola, Photographer
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Fort Worth | TX | USA | Posted: 3:22 PM on 10.09.07 |
->> Just wanted to second what Jody said...I prefer to shoot from the visitor sidelines because when I was covering the home team, and being paid for it, the colors and reactions added to the photos.
Also, it doesn't take but a second to say, "I would love to talk to you about your question and I have a few ideas that could help you, but with the game as close as it is and so little time left, I need to concentrate on the game. Here's my card, please call or email me and I'll be happy to share some tips with you."
I always keep my cards in my right thigh pocket of my cargo shorts for that reason and I end up handing out at least a couple of cards every game. Gotten some business from it, too.
As for the hangers on and others who serve no purpose other than taking up space on the sidelines, here in Texas they are cracking down on it. The reason has nothing to do with booster clubs "owning" the sidelines or the media having room to work; it has to do with liability. That kid that got plowed over at the Colorado spring game this year drove the point home and I am glad to see the districts making it harder to get access for Joe Average Citizen who wants to take some pictures for no particular reason. It's a matter of safety.
The sidelines belong to the teams, the officials, the cheerleaders and those who have a legitimate need to be there. All others belong in the stands...that's what they're built for.
Just my 3.1415 cents, your mileage may vary. |
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Jeff Mills, Photographer, Photo Editor
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Columbus | OH | USA | Posted: 9:14 PM on 10.09.07 |
->> I've always been fine with the parents, "team" photographer mom and dad's, assistants, reporters, other shooters etc. Sure they can get in the way but not as much as the tv cameramen and sound dish guys at ncaa/nfl games who I sometimes swear must be trying to block me on purpose. Most if not all parents etc have always been very mindful about getting in the way and always give up their spot saying "no no, you go ahead, you've got a job to do" and things of that nature.
HOWEVER, and here comes the rant thats been stored up in me this whole season.......
What I can't stand however are the "ball kids", obnoxious, snot nosed, hyperactive, 10 year olds who instead of paying attention to the game and doing their job prefer instead to throw the ball around, hitting me or my gear, letting a ball roll onto the field during a play etc.
Also why do we not only need little Bobby but 3 more of his friends to do a single job ? Sorry but if you need 4 kids to hold a gameball maybe you've got the wrong kids ?
Kids will be kids I understand, but maybe find some mature kids who can handle the privilige of being there ?
I remember when I was in middle school I thought it was the coolest thing to be a ball boy and get to see how the "next level" played and what I could expect for the future. I never ran around or did anything stupid. I was taking in every aspect of the game I could and I was 11 yeas old.
Heck, we could probably train some monkeys to be ball boys and they'd handle themselves better than the kids I've been seeing this year.
Last weekend one of the little brats was running around playing tag or lord knows what and ran smack into the chains knocking himself down pretty hard because he wasn't looking where he was going. He was fine of course but you know that every official on the field in addition to myself all had smiles on our faces LOL. Maybe it occured to him that sidelines are not a place to run around playing tag ?
Seriously though, thats a little bump and bruise. Whats going to happen when that kid gets clipped by a 200lbs fullback and breaks a leg or other serious injury ?
I'm a grown man and I know I'd take some real injury getting hit by a player, and we've all seen it happen I'm sure. A small child who's not paying attention could be very badly hurt.
End of rant..... |
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Alan Look, Photographer
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Bloomington | IL | United States | Posted: 10:13 PM on 10.09.07 |
->> How do you know when you have the best angle for the perfect shot?
When your blocked by everyone else on the sideline.
For all my "official" friends reading the board: I'm still stumping for electronic refs - no more refbutt... :)
(maybe they could use that overhead camera rig like they now use for nfl games for this)
I've answered questions, taught people how to use their new 10D, even fixed an obnoxious camera problem, and loaded film for others on the sideline. At one time I thought I was cutting my own throat, but those people (usually parents) don't last on the sidelines, they get replaced by more that need the same help. Like everyone says, a little tact and you can be helpful, still get your job done and sometimes gain a new friend or customer. Usually it's more than one. They tell their friends too. |
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