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|| SportsShooter.com: Member Message Board
Above the rim
John Nash, Photographer
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Rochester | NH | USA | Posted: 3:14 PM on 07.13.04 |
->> My favorite sport to shoot is basketball and now I've gone digital I'm excited for the coming winter season. Though granted, I'm going to enjoy a few months of more of basking in the sun shooting baseball.
But I was wondering what my fellow photographers thought about this:
When all those photos from directly above the rim started coming out, I thought they were new, fresh and exciting. For the past year, however, every time I see one of these shots - be it in sports illustrated or while perusing the AP wire - I've grown tired of seeing them. Every single shot looks the same.
Any other opinions? Has this once-unique angle on the game lost its luster for other shooters?
Enjoying and site and your posts. |
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Delane B. Rouse, Photographer, Photo Editor
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Waldorf | MD | US | Posted: 12:11 AM on 07.14.04 |
->> Nope. Not for me.
Has the shot of the running back giving the DB a stiff arm lost it's luster? How about the shot of "ball on bat"? |
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Matt Strasen, Photographer
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McKinney | TX | USA | Posted: 12:36 AM on 07.14.04 |
->> I haven't had the extra cameras nor the PW's to shoot from this angle, but I am looking forward to doing it when I start my new job.
So no, hasn't lost its luster with me either. |
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Robert McClory, Photographer
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Orlando | FL | USA | Posted: 9:55 AM on 07.14.04 |
->> It seems to me that in the case of the "above the rim" shot, and many other shots in basketball coverage, it is all about what is happening in the photo, not the photo itself (due to light that doesn't change much, people shooting from the baseline and not moving around, and the same 5 places for mounting a remote being used by most shooters).
I have run remotes at NBA games and I regularly moved them around to get a fresh perspective but admit that the basket mounted shots seemed to make the edit more often than not and the motivation to get a "fresh angle" was sometimes undermined.
The real bottom line is that while it may be old to you and me, editors and readers still seem to love it, and that's what really counts and that's what will continue to motivate people to shoot shots like the "above the rim" shot.
In answer to the question of the running back giving a stiff arm being old; yes it is. Not being a football shooter much myself, I LOVE when I get that shot but then I realize that there are a million more where that came from. I realize that the shot is very useable and would run in most newspapers/magazines as a good document of the game, but as for an interesting photograph it falls a little short. The fact is that there are cliche shots in every sport that will never get old to many people.
The interseting thing is you rarely see the "above the rim" or "stiff arm running back" shots win photo of the year or many other photo contests...
RM |
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Mike Brice, Photographer
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Northwood | OH | USA | Posted: 11:05 AM on 07.14.04 |
->> If I recall correctly, and chime in here, Delane won a sportsshooter monthly clip contest with an above the rim shot.
I'll go check real quick....
Yep. December 2003 - First Place Sports Action. |
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Robert McClory, Photographer
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Orlando | FL | USA | Posted: 12:28 PM on 07.14.04 |
->> Mike,
My bad, sort of.
The shot you are refering to is not the type mentioned in the original post. That is a "behind the backboard" variety of remote shot and the other is from a camera mounted in the rafters directly over the basket with usually only the rim, players directly under/around the rim and the paint in the image. Not to split hairs, but they are different shots, albiet I'm sure both have indeed won contests here and elsewhere.
I was only pointing out, and I should clarify, that cliche images that we all recognize as such, may move VERY well over the wires and fill the pages of our papers and magazines, but personally speaking, the images that stand out me go a little beyond cliche. I think one of the hardest things to do in sports photography is to get a unique image that breaks from the norm, especially in covering basketball, again for all the reasons mentioned above.
Please don't get me wrong, remote camera shots (which I have and will continue to use) and "stiff arm" shots are often spectacular, but for me the it's the unique photography that stands out more. It's the difference between what we see everyday and the compelling photography that will stand the test of time.
Sorry for the error, and sorry for the long winded attempt to correct it.
Robert |
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Mike Brice, Photographer
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Northwood | OH | USA | Posted: 12:47 PM on 07.14.04 |
->> I didn't really think you were in error, and I agree with you on the sports cliche aspect of some of these shots - move well over the wire but may not really challenge us to produce better images. But since Delane had made a post on this board, and since I remembered that he had won with that shot, I thought I would point it out. Because, frankly, if it was me, I would have been dying to point it out but too modest to do so.
I understand what you are saying about above the rim and behind the backboard.
I think what makes Delane's nice is the action that is captured. |
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Bruce Twitchell, Photographer, Student/Intern
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Lewiston | ID | USA | Posted: 12:58 PM on 07.14.04 |
->> Ah, the stiff arm shot. I was just looking through the new members and noticed Nick Mantzel's lead shot:
http://www.sportsshooter.com/members.html?id=3368
A nice pee-wee league stiff arm. Cliche? Sure, but still a nice shot to look at, especially if I were that kid's dad. |
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Thomas E. Witte, Photographer
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Cincinnati | OH | USA | Posted: 1:12 PM on 07.14.04 |
->> Double plays, stiff arms, slam dunks, diving receptions, driving goalie saves, batter photos, net cams, fish eye skater photos, wake boarders in the air, hurdler photos, cars lifting a tire off the ground in a corner.... They're all cliches. The goal for several people is to get the best cliche while others just try to go and do something different. But what is left that is different.... What ever hasn't been thought of yet.
For me, being different is just shooting tighter and tighter. For others, it's trying different locations for their remotes. Bottom line is to get a slide sheet full of edits and have fun doing it. |
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Robert McClory, Photographer
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Orlando | FL | USA | Posted: 1:12 PM on 07.14.04 |
->> I agree, it is a very nice shot and congrats to Delane for winning with it. Again, just because it is a familiar angle does not make it uninteresting. Hey, as a photographer covering the NBA for the past 9 seasons and basketball junkie, I like most any shot of basketball that is technically good. It makes it hard to edit but... so I think I am in the same boat with John.
Robert |
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Colin Corneau, Photographer
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Brandon | MB | Canada | Posted: 1:37 PM on 07.14.04 |
| ->> A good shot is a good shot is a good shot. Vantage point is only one aspect of a quality shot. |
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Robert McClory, Photographer
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Orlando | FL | USA | Posted: 2:08 PM on 07.14.04 |
->> Colin,
True and I suppose I skewed the conversation from the original post. I don't think the question was if a certain shot, in this case the above the rim shot, was good or not, but rather if anyone else but John was getting tired of it. My answer was yes, and all the rest was the why. |
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John Nash, Photographer
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Rochester | NH | USA | Posted: 5:02 PM on 07.14.04 |
->> Exactly, Robert; They just all look the same.... faces looking up, a ball, a few arms. I loved the shots when they first came out and many of them are still great photos. I guess it's just a little over exposed, pardon the pun, because it seems like all the big mags (SI, ESPN The Mag) run them each week, not to mention the AP Wire.
But I do appreciate everybody else's comments, as well. As a SS.com newbie, I'm truly enjoying the sight, I'm enjoying everybody's thoughts, and am learning a lot, too |
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Colin Corneau, Photographer
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Brandon | MB | Canada | Posted: 9:16 PM on 07.14.04 |
->> I see what you're saying, Robert...sort of a similar situation with images from inside the goalie's net in hockey. Real eye-catchers, I think.
Eventually the newness will wear off, it will become almost standard, and those images will be judged the way any other shot is. |
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Stanley Leary, Photographer
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Roswell | GA | USA | Posted: 9:20 PM on 07.14.04 |
->> While we can think something is new and eye catching, it isn't long before it is considered gimmicky.
As Ernest Hemingway said in Sun Also Arises, nothing is new under the sun. |
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